Sharon Palmer has achieved a level of fame in the food rights movement. She’s been raided four times since she moved to the Healthy Family Farm location in Ventura County, the most recent one having taken place August 3, when she was one of three individuals arrested in connection with the Rawesome Food Club roundup.
Kristin Canty’s movie, Farmageddon, features Palmer breaking into tears as she describes the seemingly unjustified raids on her farm.
But there has always been an undercurrent of concern and distress about Palmer and her motives. Those came up in comments when I wrote about the Rawesome Three just a couple weeks ago. Much of the concern stems from allegations made by food rights activist Aajonus Vonderplanitz that Palmer outsourced eggs and chickens that were made available to Rawesome members.
When I was in Los Angeles last week, I discussed the outsourcing accusations with Palmer, who said she could explain everything. She said she has been hesitant to go public because of an ongoing legal problem from the time she moved to Healthy Family Farm, in which local authorities filed charges against her for producing goat cheese without a permit.
She denied she was outsourcing chickens, but said she did outsource eggs for six or seven months in 2008 and 2009…with the partial knowledge of James Stewart, Rawesome’s manager.
Shortly after she moved to Healthy Family Farm in 2008, “We had a mountain lion kill 1,000 egg-laying birds,” she said. They comprised half her egg layers.
“James knew I was buying eggs. I bought the best eggs I could find, for seven months…None of this was secret.”
James Stewart confirmed her story about the mountain lion. He recalled going to the farm immediately after the attack on the hens. “I followed a trail of feathers up a hill. It was like a snowstorm had hit the place.”
It takes about six months to re-build egg layers, so that is why the outsourcing went on so long, she says.
But Stewart says he didn’t understand that Rawesome was receiving outsourced eggs for the entire seven month period. Stewart says he understood that for about two weeks, Rawesome would be receiving outsourced eggs, after which Rawesome would be getting its eggs entirely or nearly entirely from Healthy Family Farm. He says he understood that the outsourced eggs came from an area producer of organic eggs, Nichols Ranch, which sells under the brand of Chino Valley Eggs. At the time, the eggs were produced by chickens fed soy-based feed, says Stewart, though the producer’s web site says it now produces eggs from chickens fed soy-free diets.
Stewart says he told Rawesome members who inquired when they first saw the Chino Valley boxes that the eggs were outsourced. What about members who didn’t inquire? “I should have put up a sign,” Stewart told me. “Yes, I should have. Did I have intent not to put up a sign? No.”
Stewart now attributes what Palmer is saying to “a misunderstanding. Maybe she told me that the majority of eggs would continue coming from Nichols, and I didn’t understand.” In fact, says Palmer, the farm’s own reduced egg production was going to supply area farmers markets she serves, where there is a requirement that farmers only sell their own products.
“It was three years ago,” says Stewart. “It was not a big deal. Those were organic eggs. Did I make a mistake? Yes.”
As for the re-packaged chickens Vonderplanitz complained about, Palmer said she used outsourced chickens to compensate laborers on her farm. She was often able to acquire large quantities of mass-produced chickens that restaurants hadn’t picked up, at rock-bottom prices. The practice of compensating farm workers with food is a not uncommon practice. And because Palmer was able to negotiate good deals on the chickens, she was, in effect, saving on her compensation costs. “This is how pig pens and chicken runs were built,” she explained.
She also said she used the outsourced chickens to provide food for Moveable Feast activities (sometimes known as “Drop in the Bucket”), to which she contributes. It focuses on providing water to schools in Africa.
Stewart told me that in his experience working with food producers, the outsourcing issue with Sharon Palmer wasn’t unusual. In a number of cases, the producers are simply dishonest. “I have been lied to by cheese makers, who said their cheese was raw and organic, and it wasn’t. One supplier told me he made his cheese by heating it to 105 degrees for fifteen minutes, when it turns out to have been 140 degrees for two hours.” There have been producers of raw honey who heated their product higher than they claimed; he had to discontinue working with them.
He added that it’s his dream to re-open Rawesome with some kind of a laboratory to test products–to determine if they use GMO ingredients or have pesticides or are truly raw, among other tests. “That will solve a lot of problems,” he said.
Still and all, as Stewart suggests, the Palmer outsourcing wasn’t handled in a transparent way by any means. Rawesome members should have been fully informed about what occurred at the farm. After all, predator attacks on chickens aren’t uncommon.
Telling lies and/or misleading people is always a big deal. They have lost credibility. How could anyone trust what they say? .
"the producers are simply dishonest." " Rawesome members should have been fully informed about what occurred at the farm."
Crying because they were caught leaving the barn door opened….. Indeed, appears many are dishonest.
Since I wrote the original post earlier today, James Stewart said I hadn't reflected his recollection accurately. He later said he had been aware of the initial outsourcing of eggs, but hadn't been aware it went on as long or was as extensive as it turned out to be. So the sentence you quoted now says, "She denied she was outsourcing chickens, but said she did outsource eggs for six or seven months in 2008 and 2009…with the partial knowledge of James Stewart, Rawesome's manager." I made a few other additions of his explanation later in the post.
David
The idea that a predator attack is uncommon is strange. If your flock isn't protected, they are gone on night #2. (They find you on night #1 and invite friends on #2. This is no different in Santa Paula than Filmore. You have to account for it in your numbers)
Also strange: No, I wasn't outsourcing, I was violating the FLSA by paying my workers in chicken meat (that I repackaged so that they would think I produced it)
And: I used chicken meat to pay for chicken runs but there just wasn't enough chicken meat to pay for chicken tractors that might have made it possible to actually pasture the chickens.
Unfortunately strange: That David presents this strange story in a fact-like way.
That is when I decided to no longer buy from them. How do you trust someone who admits to outsourcing once, but swears they'll never do it again? They've already compromised their integrity.
Sylvia, this is the exact story I received via email when I railed against our local WAPF chapter co-leadership (formerly AnnMarie Michaels, and currently: Victoria Bloch and Shirley Schecker) and the WAPF leadership in Ventura County and Santa Barbara County where she also sells at farmer's markets when I first read the South Pasadena Patch article that clearly says: "L.A. County District Attorney court documents also allege that Palmer "was buying thousands of dollars worth of meat, poultry and eggs from other vendors and reselling it at farmer's markets and at Rawesome, despite claims and advertising that it was raised on her farm and not fed commercial feed."
And that is when I stopped believing what any of those characters told me. In fact, they still recommend Healthy Family Farms and one of the next WAPF-LA meetups is to visit HFF for a fall festival/pumpkin carving.
This is a house of cards that will come tumbling down. In fact it has…I wonder what percentage of Rawesome members still believe that James is an honest person? I wonder what percentage of sales HFF has dropped off since the bail documents were widely circulated here?
Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. Please heed that lesson here, folks.
What exactly are your credentials and standards as a "reporter"? I, too, write a blog about this subject but everyone can read it and realize it's by a t-eed off consumer. In fact most blogs are looked at by real journalists as inferior stuff of emotional attachment, complaint and innuendo. I think this post fits that bill.
What is your angle? Where's the critical thought… viewpoints of the other side? You write the words of these people like it is fact. Are you just trying to get their voice and their point of view out there? Do you know them personally?
You can buy pullets that are already laying. You don't need to wait for the chicks to grow and lay. Oh, but wait, the outsourcing of eggs went on from sometime in 2008 to sometime in 2010? How do we know it's not happening now?
Why would people who help her want commercially raised chicken? She told me herself she only has one part-time ranch hand. The rest are "volunteers" and probably people who believe in the real food movement. Do they know they were being given commercially raised meat and eggs?
What about all the CONSUMERS, thousands of them here in CA, who feel that they were sold a bunch of lies? What about the ones who come up to me and tell me that the quality of the meat kept changing, that they got an old off chicken…etc. etc. etc. I am beginning to wonder if this isn't a criminal case of fraud waiting to happen? Oh wait, the DA's office can still bring charges against these two. Maybe we'll wait and see what those are before we report their lies as fact?
Just wait and watch, my friends, the truth will come out eventually.
Sure.
The story before is the invoices that the DA has were for 'egg washing'….
I'll bet the story will change again over the coming weeks. When you lie once, you inevitably have to keep stretching the truth to cover your ass.
Let me get this straight…you know the eggs are outsourced….some people ask questions and you tell them (but no one else)….and you don't let others know by signage or any other communication….and then you justify that by "Did I have intent not to put up a sign? No." …uh…..if you didn't put up a sign then you damn sure had the 'intent' not to put up a sign…and if you didn't, then you 'intentionally' did not put up a sign. Does James think that the rest of us are idiots (obviously….if he expects us to believe that BS line).
This escapade will be a black eye for the movement….
Day 37 Hospital
Good news in the morning. Chris blood pressure was normal without meds and his kidneys were functioning at 75% capacity. The nephrologist was very pleased. The goal for today was to drink one once of water every hour and they would be dropping the methadone to 3mgs every 12 hours. They also suggested that Chris start chewing gum to see if this would stimulate his pancreas to work. We were told that we would probably go back to basic tomorrow.
Our next door neighbors came for a visit. One of them is a teacher at Chriss school. She brought school work for him. He was strong enough now to start getting caught up in what he missed at school. It was nice to have something else for Chris to do besides TV, Gameboy and movies in the playroom. It was also a relief to see he didnt have any brain damage. He had no problems reading or doing any of the work. It was not going to be a problem making up a months worth of school work.
This was the one day we shared the same unit with Lauren Herzog. Chris and Lauren spent a few hours playing Uno with me, Tony and Laurens grandma.
I also met Laurens dad for the first time. He shared with me that the girlfriend was very upset that the milk was being blamed for the kids illness. Remember the girlfriend and the farmer had much contact during this timeframe. He went out to dinner with her when he came for the visit at the hospital and she went up to his farm when that had the end of the recall party. Much discussion and speculation had taken place as to what they thought made the kids ill.
Meanwhile, here at the hospital, based on the experience of treating multiple cases of treating HUS every year, they believed the raw milk most likely was the cause of the kids becoming ill. Typically PICUs see about 2-4 cases of HUS each year. The statistical chances of two children showing up at the same PICU, during the same timeframe, being unrelated and consuming the same food that is considered high risk for food poisoning, well, there wasnt discussion that it could have been anything else.
Blood pressure good all night. He slept really well.
For those of you who continue to gossip using false statements and still choose to sit at your computer instead of visiting the farm shame on you as I view you just as bad as the goverment officials who make Raw milk a bad thing! I have opened my farm up to all of you skeptics.. I fought the vicious lies with the best defence of come and see with your own eyes.If your food source is really that important to you,step away from your computer and visit the farm that feeds your family,talk to the farmer about their practices.If you don't like it,don't support them…This is America,you have a choice.
James and Rawesome members deserved the best quality and that is what they received.
I wonder if or when we'll see an end to the pollution of your otherwise excellent website, with the years' old detrius from another movie … Mrs Martin's yelping?
your refusal to deal appropriately with the hysterical mother, does her no favours. You're enabling her to stay locked-in to hysteria. It reminds me of the wonders multi-culturalism has brought to my neighbourhood … crappy signs tacked on street posts, graffiti everywhere and trash dumped on boulevards … conditions we once thought part of the Third world, are now accepted as normal
would you tolerate a screaming, out-of-control 2 year old child, throwing a fit, in a movie theatre? There are different rules for different spaces
So as a Family Farmer who has been crucified by the goverment for supporting Raw milk and the right for people to own their own animal and posess their own milk do not cast judgement until you are in my shoes. I am always available for questions,my farm is open to the public on Sundays and any documentation you feel you need to see has always been available for review.
Please step back and think about your comments before you post. This unfortunate incident and criminal action against us is a chance to set national precident. Its a chance to make the Raw Milk issue nationally known,its a chance to expose the FDA for funding raids on small farms and businesses. I am grateful for writers such as David and Dairymen such as Mark and activists such as Max for comming to La to support the cause. I hope all of you are as well! Lets post about how we can create a grand protest of our rights!! Lets write about how we win this war on Food rights.
Your question about my credentials encouraged me to update the bio section of this web site, so you'll see info there. I think you said it best–your ultimate weapon as a consumer is to take your business elsewhere.
David
There are a lot of questions surrounding your farm, so I'll keep my question to the narrow topic you mention here: the eggs.
I had not heard of the alleged outsourcing before the Vonderplanitz information and then read that you were using the other egg company to wash your eggs. I believe this point of gossip was via the Santa Barbara WAPF people. The eggs would be washed and put in those other cartons, explaining the other cartons and your regular appearance at that other vendor. I have no idea if that point was true, but it was used to explain your trips to an egg vendor.
Now Gumpert reports today that you *were* outsourcing eggs for a time in 2008-09.
You state here in your comments that you really weren't outsourcing, just delivering eggs to Rawesome from another vendor.
In regards to those purchased eggs, you say that consumers would know they were not your eggs because they were in another carton.
Gumpert previously reported that you reuse cartons from other vendors as a cost-savings measure.
Here's my core question: When customers saw your distributed/outsourced eggs in a carton from another vendor and they were used to seeing your eggs in cartons from another vendor that washes your eggs (or generic cartons), how were they to know that the eggs in question were *not* from you after all? You say it was no secret and point to the cartons. Help me understand how the cartons would have helped in this instance. Did you have branded cartons in 2009? Do you reuse cartons from other vendors?
Perhaps you can describe for us the care you took in informing Rawesome management and members back when they were buying the outsourced/distributed eggs. I am interested more in how you and the Rawesome management educated the people who didn't call you — those are the people in most need of the information.
Amanda
Now people sit on their fat asses, stare into the virtual world of disconnected digital blogosheres and bitch and moan and moan bitch about the nuances of the kind of food they have. Not that they have food…..no…the ridiculous minutiae details about the kind of food they have.
All you negative foody people need to go volunteer in deep Mexico for a week or better yet go to Africa. Get a life!!! Starve a little. Think of Mike Schmidt and Max.
Sharon Palmer screwed-up….she also did not do all the horrible things that your hating wild imaginations dream that she did.
Try walking a mile in her shoes….try being humanitarian and compassionate. Try building up some karma points with things that really matter. Try adding goodness to this world.
Rawesome members relied on the quality…not the farm. They relied on James to find quality,he was happy with the research I did and supplied the quality they were searching for. The farm was merely a supplier of eggs and chicken,there are other suppliers also.
Farming is an evolution,we learn to produce better,we learn to inform better. We may not do everything right…but we do it for the right reason unlike commercial producers who do it for the money. I hope this answers your question.
I work my small farm by myself….essentially. I don't have a nice office….an airplane to fly around in…employees to do my dirty work….no european vacations or jaunts around the country to help fool raw milk farmers that I have 'their' best interest at heart….and I damn sure don't need to go volunteer in a third world country to justify in my heart the millions of dollars I am making. You are a low life Mark…you feel that just because you sign your real name you have the right to put down everyone else…. I can't wait to meet you again…just so I can spit a giant goober in your pathetic face….walk a mile in her shoes my ass. Sharon is a liar….so is James…and your defense of them speaks volumes about YOUR credibility.
Next time you come east make sure you have a hanky….
Cows milk from Pennsylvania? Crossing state lines….. page 4
Page 7 raw chicken near milk?
Count 9 on page 13 labeling issue
Mark, sometimes your words are so full of crap. She either out-sourced or not..and/or the consumers were not all informed, the story keeps changing. It is kinda like being pregnant, you either are or you are not.
All those "fat asses" read many avenues to obtain their information and the majority has not been favorable towards those charged. If someone lies about one thing, how would I know they won't repeat the behavior? I don't, so there is no trust. People don't change.
The media hasn't printed anything positive about her farming habits history.
Honesty is what matters, and it apparently has been lacking. I would be livid if I found out I was not buying what I had contracted to buy and to find out I was eating something that was not what I thought……. That is deceit, fraud, any of those labels would fit.
"people who post with commentary that is frivioulous and mirrors the propaganda of the goverment"
Frivolous? Hardly so. When there are questionable actions, then only a complete fool would sit back and ignore it. If there is no honesty, then you are no better than the govt.
http://southpasadena.patch.com/articles/healthy-family-farms-to-stay-at-farmers-market
"was buying thousands of dollars worth of meat, poultry and eggs from other vendors and reselling it at farmer's markets and at Rawesome, despite claims and advertising that it was raised on her farm and not fed commercial feed."
If it is found that the allegations are true, that would be a more than black eye on the food movement.
I have spoken directly with you on the phone and you answered my questions. I also visited the farm on a non-open farm day so I was not able to see you or ask my questions because you weren't there.
I have just one question. What do you feed your chickens? Do you feed your egg layers the same feed as the meat chickens? Can you give the brand name? If you make your own, can you describe the process you use for making feed for 4,000 egg layers (last I checked it was 2,000 in April, reported by Ventura Ag…do you self report or do they come out and count?) and the 1200 broilers?
Thank you,
Kristen
The 'nice or nothing' worked well in elementary school. If adults did it, this world would be even more screwed up…but there again, it seems that you prefer living in a sanitized world, where everything is always hunky dory…and evil and wrong flourish under the camoflage of silence.
I'm glad that I don't have a monopoly on outrage.
Please think about what you have to say before you spout off and spit in your own customer's face.
"Now people sit on their fat asses, stare into the virtual world of disconnected digital blogosheres and bitch and moan and moan bitch about the nuances of the kind of food they have. Not that they have food…..no…the ridiculous minutiae details about the kind of food they have."
It is my understanding that you market directly to your consumers…people who care about the quality of the food that they eat. They care about the husbandry and the feed of the animals that they eat and glean products from such as milk and eggs. They are increasingly educated on food matters exactly because of the internet and computers. Most of them sit at a computer all day to make the money it takes to buy your raw milk at $16-$20 per gallon. I think a vast majority of your consumers are urbanites and who are very involved in the details of their food and where it comes from.
What was your point again?
You took the words right out of my mouth . . .
From another small Eastern Farmer . . . who has just one capable intern to help out just two days a week . . . I do all the routine chores myself btw:)
Deborah Peterson, are you a farmer? If not, then you really don't understand what Milk Farmer just said . . .and to think that Mark should try to tell us small producers here out East how to farm . . .and to disregard our outrage over outsourcing in Sharon Palmer's case . . . for shame. Mark never answered my questions about contacting small artisanal dairies out east (in states where raw milk is legal) for RAWMI certification btw . . .The more I hear from Mark the less I like about him (I was a supporter of Mark up until last winter when he came out against my stance on S-510).
I would never, ever even think to outsource my Icelandic lamb, fiber, heritage poultry, eggs, and produce. . . don't think Milk Farmer would either. We stand by the quality of our products . . that is why we are so angry. . .
Kind regards,
Violet
http://www.kilbyridgefarmmaine.blogspot.com
There is a reason regulators and judges exist.
MW
Stand with you on this. . . feed, water and tend my animals myself with my husband's help on Christmas eve, Christmas Day, Thanksgiving, New Years . . . etc., as a former suburbanite I have been humbled and vastly rewarded . have not had a vacation or left my farm for more than two days in 6 years (when I gave birth to my daughter) but I still would never, ever trade my current farm based life for the one I had before:)
Kind regards,
Violet
http://www.kilbyridgefarmmaine.blogspot.com
Be certain….if Marys kid (and the others) didn't get sick….and the scrutiny of Mark's farm increased….he'd still be outsourcing today. And despite the bogus reason, usually given, of 'serving the customer' or 'answering the demand'….the real motivation for outsourcing is singular….increased sales/profit. Gordon Gekko would approve.
I suggest you take your own advice and say nothing more……..after all you wouldn't want to be a hypocrite, would you? Or do you, like Mark, allow arrogance and delusions of superiority, to justify your dictating to others?
Your 'line' doesn't matter….and neither does mine. It's Davids blog.
PS although it's been a few years, I (and my wife) have been tested. lol.
And, by the way, in some states it is a crime for an adult to spit at another person's face….just saying!!! For the record, I wasn't referring to that type of testing….I was referring to hepatitis & other diseases of that sort.
I've always said the truth will come out. I may not agree with some of the behavior and what transpired. Well people now can choose to buy, believe or forgive Sharon or James.
I am certainly not going to judge any individuals here except to say it's so so sad to see so many good folks ripping into each other. It so easy to attack and judge folks. I was taught not to spread gossip and to treat people with respect even if you disagree with their viewpoints. I hope that people reflect upon their own words and actions and maybe ask yourself what the big picture is and what now? What actions can you take now to repair the world…
Heck, I'm sure if Jesus Christ was alive today, he'll be be posting his opinion and getting ripped to shred. I'm sure I'll get some flak for invoking his holy name here.
Also I'm sure our good friends at Monsanto and Cargill and Dean are having a good laugh at all this.
Peace!
If something is outsourced, then it really is not your product, it would be the product of whomever you outsourced it from.
There is a history of (remove WAPF chapter leaders- insert govt) giving bad advice to new farmers ,,,,, the govt gives bad advice all the time. What's your point in singling out wapf?
"should not be "leading" a local food movement. "
Who said wapf was leading? I rarely bump into someone who knows who they are. What in your opinion makes them a leader? Who designated them a "leader" ? There are many "leaders" of local food movements all over the US who have nothing to do with wapf. Why single them out? Is there fear of them? That is like saying OP is the "leader" of raw milk..if by selling the most makes him a leader, then yes he is a leader in sells….it does not make him a leader of a raw milk movement. I do believe because he has $$$ to back him and he is loud, he makes the govt nervous. Obviously many drink his milk daily and to take that away would piss many off, yet that doesn't make him a leader in a movement, only the best selling raw milk farm.
http://www.progressivedairy.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=2769:1109-pd-largest-rotary-parlor-in-us-began-milking-this-year&catid=69:legacy
Should we call the Faria dairy a leader because they have 7100 cows milked 3 times a day and the cows live in barns and have their tails docked? No.
"There is a reason regulators and judges exist."
Indeed, Many have proven many times over not to be trusted and they step outside the law. And look at above link and see what the regulators/judges condone.
If it is found that the allegations are true, the food movement will go on, it will become stronger and probably cause people to be scrutinize on a deeper level where their food comes from. This whole episode probably has people being more vigilant in in looking out for any deceit.
My husband and I have farmed for nearly 40 years, we have cattle that are pastured 6 months of the year, we grow our own feed as well as wheat etc. I know all about the demands of the farm, when the alfalfa is ready you must be out there, even if it is 2 am and you have worked all day. The up side is people with dairy goats want my husband's hay, because he is so particular. In SD caring for cattle in the winter is no joke. The 5th generation has begun working here so although there are some things I would change, there is a lot done right. I get my milk from 2 friends/relatives. One has a few goats, one has a few cows. I pick up my milk, that gives me a close up and personal look at where my milk is from. I seldom buy anything from the grocery store. No meat, cheese, butter or milk for sure. If there is a problem with how one perceives someones farming methods or produce, get out there and take a look if you can, if you can't either try and find sommeone you trust who can do that for you, or change providers. Violet, you seem to have the perfect place, I would love to see it.
While I don't think we always have to be 'nice', it behooves us to be civil. Civility is at the root of all good communication. Name calling and spitting, even internet spitting, gets us nowhere.
Now I am at the risk of being what I accused others of, a repeater. So will sign off with a simple thanks for this site David, it means a lot to me as did your book.
The fact is that "gossip" has been happening on this very blog for months and it is an important way to shine light on food production. Since Sharon has provided eggs that were not hers, this sort of discussion will only continue and I would hope that this call to end the "gossip" will also end and, rather, people will embrace the freedom for consumers to educate themselves, including with information from Santa Barbara that apparently was intended to support HFF but was not actually true according to Palmer's account here. If you run up against the "gossip" comment somewhere else online, one option is to point people here where they can ask Sharon herself.
The above is from Sept 2010.Start at pages 13-14……. I found this surfing the net.
I hope you all feel the same way about everything you have written.
That is the investigation hired by Vonderplanitz. Sharon has admitted to outsourcing/distributing another product into 2009, but that report suggests it happened into 2010. The apparent evidence collected by the court may support it.
Sharon,
Thank you for answering my question and being around to address the "gossip." The problem for me at this point is the PI report above. Vonderplanitz has given 20-30 years to this movement and I have to give him the respect of what he has paid into the movement. It is doubtful to me that he would squander it over a "personal vendetta" (as has been claimed). If you would like to address the allegations in the PI report that your egg outsourcing continued into 2010, I would be open to hear what you have to say, especially if it is more fact-based than an attack on Vonderplanitz. Some information from WAPF that appears to have been removed from the Internet explains it with an egg-washing story that you seem to dismiss here.
Amanda
Every small business goes through growth spurts and comes to a point where demand outpaces supply and they have to figure out how to handle it. It is unfortunate in this situation that an unwitting farmer lost most of her supply to a mountain lion. But it is equally unfortunate at what she did afterward.
Compromise your integrity as a businessperson and you never get it back again.
Outsourcing is outsourcing is outsourcing. There is a reason it is against the rules at Farmer's Markets and they TRUST that you only sell your own. Consumers are TRUSTING that you are providing your own. If you cannot provide your own, you kindly tell your customers that you are sorry but you are hoping to have more soon. It may disappoint a few customers, but I think most would respect you for being honest. And if they care about your business they will wait and be back.
Trust is the key word here.
It also shows that you care about your land, the soil, and the care of your animals over making tons of money. There are shortcuts in agriculture and the largest companies have figured out exactly how to make money by producing animals bigger and faster. Small farms seem to figure out how to make more money by outsourcing.
Is the small farmer who outsources any better than the big agribusiness in caring about their end product and the health and security of their consumers, the very people who pay their bills?
Peace and love. In my prior job as a paramedic…. I have been spit-on, vomited-on, crapped- on, screamed-at, bitten, hit, nearly stabbed, shot-at, assaulted and threatened.
Nothing new here.
The smaller farmers need to understand that RAWMI is a new very good friend. RAWMI is a resource to you. A new tool to communicate your hard work to your consumers. It is 100% voluntarily. Nothing at RAWMI is forced or mandated. When your bacteria counts are wonderfully low, pathogen free, and your raw milk is delicious….and you are proud of it, then why wouldn't you be proud of this data.
The raw milk movement needs to be transparent and show what it can do consistently and safely. Lower insurance rates for farmers, national respect, consumers safety and health. A reconnection between farmers and their consumers? this is critical.
Milk Farmer is not a real person to me. People have real names. Why is it that people can not use real names? What is it about using your real name that is so scary??? What ever happened to courage and standing up?? I have said this before and now I have said it again.
Mary Martin, Dr. Amanda Rose and many others use their real names. Why not everyone?
To spit in my face is not a refection on me….I would not be slowed one tenth of a second by spit in my face. The only tragic part of this….is that the spit supposedly comes from a small farmer that can not see the support that I give small farmers.
A small farmer that can not see…..that is the tragedy of it all.
Any time a hot button is pushed…there is a deeper issue. What is the deeper issue? Success…is that the issue??? I want success for all of us. I want raw milk to take on many faces and sizes of success. I envision successful 5 cow raw milk dairies and 250 cow dairies. There is no one size fits all for the moedl of a raw milk success story….but success brings happiness and health to those in a successful food chain.
I am happy…I wish everyone that is involved with raw milk happiness. If you do not have success or happiness, they you need help and I would like to be part of that story. Why….because it takes nothing from me to share and I care about all of America and all of its health. Raw milk is one of the most powerfully healing foods and all Americans deserve to have access to farmers that are safe and can produce this wonderful food.
Save your saliva and swallow hard….it is your issue. Think about it. Standing on Sharon Palmers neck with rumor and hate is no way to live. It is unchristian and un humanitarian.
Nope. Success is not the issue here. Raw milk in CA is more successful than ever. Raw milk consumers are demanding raw milk more than ever.
The deeper issue is integrity, Mark.
"Integrity: adherence to moral and ethical principles; soundness of moral character; honesty"
the kvetching against Mark McAffee is covetous-ness … He's a classic American success story, providing REAL MILK to thousands of people who otherwise would not have it.
as for hidden identities = take a look at Norman Rockwell's " Town Hall meeting" …open honest countenances as they listen to what one of their kinsmen has to say …. the very opposite situation as cyber-snipers do their dirty-work from the shadows. "They that lie hate the light ; they hate the light because their deeds are evil"
Gordon S Watson, Burnaby British Columbia < http://www.freewebs.com/bovinity >
You did make me laugh out loud. Covetousness? Not in this lifetime. Why would you think that is so? What is there to covet about him? His money? Not an issue with me, his business? I am retired, I enjoy not having the headaches…his going to another country to volunteer? I've done so many times here in America. His standing up for others? I've been an advocate for others most of my life, his standing up to the govt? I've done that too….so what is there to covet? Not a damn thing.
As for complaining about Mark, I cannot speak for anyone but myself, he tends to verbalize in the grandiose style, many times his words are way off the charts, if others disagree with something he says, he tends to become offensive and demeaning.
I think many on this board think it is great that he can provide raw milk to many, and also many agree that teaching about raw milk and what consumers should know about farming is also needed. Everyone has their way of doing things, some are not accepting of another's way and don't appreciate another pushing it on them.
As stated in above post, integrity is needed for anything to succeed.
If you start outsourcing, you as a farmer are responsible to ensure that everyone who buys your products are aware. That also goes for the person distributing the product. Even more so if there are contracts between the consumer and distribute/farmer…. If your brochures state all animals are pastured only/organic,from a certain place, etc, then I would expect that to be the truth. Without informing the consumers is nothing less than fraud.
October 14, 2006
Day 37 Hospital
After the doctors did their rounds, we moved back to the basic unit. Chris lipase levels had gone up, so they wanted us to reduce water and gum chewing. He ended up only drinking 1 ounces that day. Methadone was being reduced to two days at each level instead of three. They talked about trying oral meds in a few days.
Chris was quite thin. In fact, both Tony and I had lost a considerable amount of weight. Tony had lost so much weight that his pants were falling off of him. I was down to 105 pounds. That is thin when you are 5 feet six inches tall. I joked with the nephrologist that we would be the Skelton Family for Halloween.
I dont understand how they determine what to put in the TPN, but it was decided that Chris needed to put on some pounds so they increased the dextrose to something like 20 or 25%. The down side of this is that Chris had to have finger prick tests twice a day to make sure his blood sugar levels were not too high. This brought a new round of anxiety.
It was a typical day of TV, Gameboy, movies, Uno, and homework. Chris was sweating while sleeping. It was a new symptom. We didnt have a roommate, so Chris and I got great nights sleep.
Even though Laurens blood pressure remained high, it was under control. She went home. Laurens blood pressure would remain high for some time. Unfortunately, her kidneys never regained a full recovery. She continued to spill protein into her urine. For the past five years she has had to take an ace inhibitor to control her kidney functions. She has stage one kidney disease. Someday she will need kidney dialysis and most likely a kidney transplant.
Your words are very very true and important. We do not have perfect Martyrs….we must definitely remember who are true enemy is. Mike Schmidt is battling this demon right now. 20 years of battle has worn him down and he is now giving his life and blood for the people of Canada. The people of Canada that appear not to read studies in EU about how effective raw milk to build immune systems, prevent asthma, prevent ear infections, build bone density, fix gut problems etc…
Mikes fasting reminds me that people do not know what they have lost because it was lost more than three generations ago. There is no base in Canada to fight and liberate the oppression of raw milk. There has been no market created. Canada is not California. In California if raw milk was suddenly outlawed…there would be serious unrest and moms would go to Sac to have some bodies lunch. Mike is by himself struggling with demons that he is quietly fighting….with no large markets to support him.
Mike….dear friend, please give up on starvation as a means to convince the masses to change. They will not see your suffering as a motivation to change.
Canada will change when the people of Canada become upset and find out that pasteurized milk is the most allergenic food in Canada and join you to change the laws in Canada so they can drink raw milk. We need you strong. We need you lucid in thought. When Cesar Chavez fasted he weakened…be was of no use to his people. They carried him during protests and he died very early in life as a result. This is no way to protest…this is not an example for raw milk.
People across north America consider you the Ghandi of raw milk. I agree, but I also disagree. Ghandi was Ghandi. You have music to right, songs to sing and people to lead and babies to feed.
Please please…start eating. Declare victory and dine. The judges are asses….you are not. Judges do not change law. They are puppets of it. Laws are changed by the people and education of the people and legislature.
To me, it was absolutely unnecessary for the government to raid Rawesome in the fashion that it did. I think they took advantage of a sour apple to suit their own purposes. I think it's imperative as supporters of the raw milk/foods movement to understand this, and to act accordingly. It surprises me that NO ONE has talked about the other providers of Rawesome in terms of economic harm caused by the raid. Don't get me wrong, if I were a member of Rawsome, I'd be livid at their management and Sharon Palmer for failing to provide organic foods. In a perfect world, Rawesome's manager should have rejected food from Palmer, and then notified the farmer's markets that she serves. This can all be done WITHOUT the government getting involved, much less a military-style raid.
See George Gordon, "The Law Enforcement Growth Industry":
http://deoxy.org/lawenfor.htm
According to what Ive read, the prosecutor has said that there will be additional charges in December, but that those will be for James Stewart, not Sharon. It seems to me that after two years of an undercover investigation costing millions of dollars and including three paid informants and four raids on her farm in which computers, files, paperwork, etc were taken, that if Sharon had sold product to the public fraudulently then most likely the government would have found some kind of evidence with which to charge her.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion on that, of course, but the bottom line is that the situation is out of our hands now. The trial has gone public and none of us are Food Police. All we can do is wait and watch.
If you think Sharon is a bad farmer, dont eat her food. If you truly know something incriminating about the case, then by all means speak to the prosecutor. That's what a trial is for.
And if you do have a reasonable allegation that already has been brought to the prosecution, then I'm sure you've been told by an attorney not to speak about it publicly.
So from my perspective anything derogatory said in a public forum about how Sharon has or does conduct her business at this point risks looking like blowing hot air for personal aggrandizement.
It is not as simple as "Just don't buy." I let my friends know as well because they, too, have a right to information about the care of their families. My informing them doesn't actually make me a jerk. I do agree that informing them should have been the role of the vendor, not me. I worked for six months to get the vendor to tell my friends, but he apparently didn't think they needed to know. We all have different standards apparently.
If such a situation is happening in So Cal, moms there have a right to know even that there just *might* be a controversy. They can then use their own skills to make the decision that's best for their family.
Amanda