Sylvia Onusic
It’s the scandal that won’t go away for the Weston A. Price Foundation.
The scandal, of course, is the refusal of the foodie organization to step back from its enthusiastic endorsement of so-called fermented cod liver oil since a flood of health concerns began coming to light in 2014 and 2015. The latest flareup over FCLO comes with the publicly announced resignation by one of the organization’s directors, nutritionist Sylvia Onusic.
In a statement posted on her web site and on her Facebook page, the nutritionist blames WAPF’s founder, Sally Fallon Morell, for her “continued insistence that FCLO be an integral ingredient in the homemade infant formula recipe, despite the possibility that the product may be harmful.” WAPF has long recommended a homemade infant formula based on raw cow or goat milk for mothers who encounter difficulties breast feeding.
Though Onusic only joined the board in 2017, she has been involved in WAPF research and information projects since 2011, when she helped draft supporting evidence for a WAPF court case over the use of soy in prison food; the suit was eventually dismissed by a federal judge.
Onusic says the continuing FCLO situation made her involvement on the WAPF board untenable, since “one of the major policies and positions of the WAPF is to defend and promote the use of FCLO unquestioningly. I cannot in good faith uphold this loyalty oath. First do no harm.”
In an interview, she told me that she had tried privately to convince Fallon-Morell to back away from the FCLO endorsement. “Sally asked me to join the board, out of the blue. I thought about it. I thought maybe I could help the board, bring them into the modern world in some respects. Quickly I found out that Sally will listen to you, but nothing ever changes.” Indeed, according to Onusic, WAPF’s founder refers to herself as “the benevolent dictator.” She added that another member has been after WAPF to change its infant formula to eliminate the FCLO from the recipe.
In her statement, Onusic reiterated concerns raised by Kaayla Daniel, a former WAPF vice president, who was booted off the board in 2015 after she released results of a study she conducted suggesting that FCLO is rancid. According to Onusic, “The product is made with raw fish livers, a probiotic, a carbohydrate, and other ingredients, which lie in a vat for several months under the sun, without refrigeration or protection from deterioration. However, there is little transparency surrounding the production of FCLO. A former board member [Kaayla Daniel] presented laboratory analysis of FLCO based on state of the art methods (nuclear magnetic resonance) from top marine lipid laboratories which showed rancidity, the possibility of added vegetable oils, controversial levels vitamin D to vitamin A, and no vitamin K2 or CoQ10 content (as previously promoted stated on the label). The testing raised the possibility of harm and risk of harm, which should be investigated. However, no discussion was permitted about the issue at the time and the member was removed from the Board. But the elephant is still in the room.”
**
While we are on the subject of infants…..There is a followup report from NPR on the American effort to derail a World Health Organization initiative to encourage breast feeding over commercial infant formula. The report indicates the U.S. has, in the past been kind of neutral when the subject has come up, and that the recent opposition from the Trump administration is the most serious opposition ever.
There is also followup news on the outbreak of E.coli O157:H7 in Tennessee in May that sickened 15 children. It seems there were two varieties of the E.coli at work, likely one at a raw milk dairy serving herdshare members that sickened ten, and another at a day care facility where goats were around that sickened five. At least four had HUS (hemolytic uremic syndrome), a complication of the infection that often shuts down kidney function for a time. All but one of the children but have been released from the hospital; the one still hospitalized is a two-year-old boy understood to have been sickened by the raw milk, who has had a very difficult time with complications from the HUS; it’s uncertain what ongoing problems he might have both physically and mentally.
BUTTER OIL X CAPSULES WERE FROM BUTTER THAT WAS FROM ARGENTINA AND THEY WERE PURE WHITE IF IT WAS INDEED PASTURED IT SHOULD BE YELLOW NOT WHITE….WEIRD….TESTED THEM IN A CANADIAN LAB…. RUSSIAN GUY.HE GAVE ME SOME PRETTY STRANGE ANSWERS.I WILL NOT SAY ANY MORE THAN THIS.
Why are you keeping that a secret? I’d like to know what you found.
Some mammals, including some breeds of cattle and most goats, completely convert carotenoids into true Vit. A, thus rendering the butterfat white rather than yellow. This, from a University of Wisconsin Masters Degree dairy farmer, and other sources. Don’t judge a milk by its cover.
Oh, so it’s ok for fat in butter oil to be white so long as the product is Green Pasture brand and comes from Dave Wetzel? What kind of double standard is that? You know darn well pale butter donated to a WAPF conference in Anaheim in 2015 was rejected in favor of a more yellow butter from a vendor favored by Sally. As it turns out that Amish vendor was selling illegal dairy taken across state lines and people were even sickened from listeria. I guess sickness doesn’t matter if Sally approves the vendor or product.
Maureen,
Weren’t you the person that told Mark and Blaine McAfee that their generous donation of over 150 lbs of grass-fed, organic butter was rejected because “it wasn’t yellow-enough”? The Amish butter, transported over State lines from PA to CA, was used instead? What really alarmed me was that the Amish raw milk, (in addition to the fact that this milk was sold illegally at the conference by two boys and that Amos, the owner, was not even there), was given to the children in the daycare program. That milk was later implicated in a listeria scare which was blasted all over the internet. That event gave ALL raw milk a black eye.
have you spoken with amos personally sylvia ?
you really should.
have you ever tried raw grass fed milk with a touch of listeria in it….probably not
i have and did not get sick at all nothing is illegal when its been grandfathered in by the allmighty..shame on you they were kids…are you one of those lemoanade nannys that goes around and stops the kids stands from happeneing
it wasnt goat milk that was used to make the x factor butter oil
it was cow
yes you are right some cattle will produce white milk…but thats because they have been given grain as diet not green pasture
and these x factor butter oil capsules were touted as “pastured based” from cow
I have never seen David Wetzel say his butter oil was from goats??? What are you talking about????
I ended up throwing out my butter oil from him it was so gross tasting. I’ve had ghee from goats and butter oil or ghee from cows from many sources. I’ve never tasted anything that as bad as Green Pastures. What he did to it I have no idea but it sure wasn’t normal.
Gross. You got that right. Wetzel advertised his butter as coming from contented cows grazing happily in the Midwest. No, it comes from Argentina. He leaves it sitting around baking and rotting in the hot solar facility. Kayla learned that from some of Wetzel’s employees. Was one of the last chapters in her report but hardly anyone read that far. One more reason not to trust Sally and her favorite company Green Pastures. Smells bad and labs showed bad.
Kyle
I read the entire report and was stunned to read this about the butter oil but it certainly explained how horrible it tasted.
I’ve got quality grassfed ghee that’s been “forgotten” in our pantry for a few years. It tastes exactly like it did when I ordered it.
Wetzel always made it sound like he or neighboring farms were producing the ghee. Argentina….give me a break.
Btw…one of the ghee producers I buy from, told privately their tested ghee came out way higher than Green Pastures. The producer was confused how this happened. I couldn’t figure it out either until, duh, Kaalya’s report came out.
I don’t trust Sally and I surely don’t trust Green Pastures. I’m just sorry to read others who don’t know both sides of this still do.
thats all x factor was “glorified ghee”
X FACTOR BUTTER CAPSULES THEY WERE SELLOING WERE ALL STARK WHITE IN COLOR.BUTTER ALLEGEDLEY CAME FROMAN ARGENTINA FARM I WAS TOILD.IF IT WAS INDEED PASTURED WHY THE WHITE COLOR .WHEN OPENED UP I SQUISHED SOME OUT REMINDED ME OF CRISCO.
SENT IT TO A CANADIAN LAB…RUSSIAN GUY… HE SAID SOME PRETTY WEIRD THIGS IN REPORT
Kathy, I would be interested in seeing that lab report. You can contact me through my website drkaayladaniel.com Thanks.
hi kaayla..great writing you do and humorous.anyway i dont want to take it further.i dont think i should.i found it out…stopped selling it…thats that.i dont know ….something in me says forgive and foreget.
I would say forgive and forget too. Except the products are still on the market and men, women and children are being harmed.
hi kaayla
there is enough adverse information out there against this product for those informed consumers to research .and these kind of folks are the kind of folks that do their homework.
I know 3 individuals that still have it available to consumers or members …however not one sale in a year they have had.
we don’t need some government agency stepping in to stop this so it doesn’t get to babies and other people.…we had you ELASTIGIRL( lol)
you got the word out and i think folks were testing this product also.maybe the company corrected their errors I’m not sure
I think we don’t need a government agency stepping in at this point you did the job ELASTIGIRL… PEOPLE WHO ARE SMART RESEARCH AND YOU MADE ALOT OF RESEARCH AVAILABLE TO THEM.i know of 1 person that still is trying to bring this oil to his members …but not one sale in a year…so progress was made.however the company might of cleaned up a bit also…I’m not sure
Groundbeef
One would hope people would see see the avderse information floating on the internet but that’s not what happens in real life. People read the weston price foundation info and dig into rancid oils thinking they’ve done their homework.
They are stunned when they get sent info that shows maybe these oils aren’t such a good idea.
OFF TOPIC A BIT BUT ….. THE NEW INCREDIBLES 2 CARTOON MOVIE FOR KIDS IS ALLMOST LIKE THE RAW MILK PLIGHT. AS WE ALL KNOW IT..WHATS EVEN WEIRDER IS THAT IN THE MOVIE THROUGHOUT THEY SHOW GLASSES OF MILK AND CONTAINERS OF MILK.
Hi Gound Beef,
Would you contact me regarding the butter oil capsules and the analysis? I would really appreciate the opportunity to talk to you. (sylvia@drsylviaonusic.com) If those capsules indeed contain Crisco or a similar fat, the research overwhelmingly shows that hydrogenated fats are dangerous ( and banned in the US). Our food chain is now top heavy on linoleic acid (seed and “vegetable” oils like corn, soybean, safflower, canola, etc.), an omega-6 fatty acid, which actually disrupts the fatty acid content of body tissues and plays a major role in inflammation, thus adversely affecting physical and mental health.
If you read the butter oil section on Dr. Kaayla Daniel’s expose, “Hook, Link and Stinker,” you know she did test the butter oil and to the best of my recollection, testing showed it to be rancid. She also learned it was from Argentina even though we all thought it was from Dave Wetzel’s rolling green pastures. If you look into the background of Argentina and Brazil, you will read that the use of pesticides and herbicides can be virtually uncontrolled. These go into the water and the air. For that reason, I do not consume any food products from those countries.
sylvia i only told one individual about this and i showed her the capsules.i dont want to take it any further as if these were bad …lets let it all be.forgive and forget i think
another thing on the argentina resource…
thats whats equally importiant is that american farmers were not being supported in making this product… and also since the oil was from a different region with different flora it does not benefit the individual to the optimum as far as immune system,allergies etc…its best to eat your food from places that are no more than 50 miles from where you live ideally.but i still think its ok that i drink milk from pa which has the same fl;ora still and its approx 200 miles away.
I’ve been member of the Weston A Price Foundation since 2008. Their sound nutritional advice has helped me to improve my health and immune system. I just saw an article written by Sylvia Onusic on it home page. If there were these types of issues with the company Blue Ice Cod Liver Oil they would have been taken off the shelf by now. We live in a world and country where being healthy is very difficult due to the marketing propaganda to enrich food processors and pharmaceutical companies. Weston A Price is a good resource to have during these deceitful times.
I joined the WAPF in 2006 and, like you Cindy, benefited from their nutritional advice for many years. However, I was always a bit suspicious of Wetzel’s FCLO; it’s taste, smell and color were quite off-putting and it didn’t seem possible an oil could be fermented. I also had personal dealings with Wetzel that left me wondering if he was hiding something. I did not renew my membership in 2016, I can’t support an organization unwilling to listen to its member’s concerns. Sally continues to endorse FCLO and turns a deaf ear to any who disagree. I am not alone, the Foundation’s membership has been shrinking ever since this controversy erupted. I suggest we all use critical thinking in choosing our nutrition, not blindly follow Sally or any other “authority”. There are other reliable resources for diet/health information.
Lynn: I fully agree. I miss all the wonderful people I used to see at the conferences, but I no longer trust the organization. I think Dr. Price would be horrified at what they are doing in his name. We have lots of resources on line, and fully-functioning brains.
Sadly Sally herself has shown herself to be deceitful. Over and over. And retaliates against anyone who questions her.
Sally called herself a dictator, but someone here chastised me for calling her a tyrant.
Let’s not forget the sexual abuse issue, i.e. http://www.cheeseslave.com/wapf-sexual-harassment-scandal-dr-kaayla-daniel-apologizes-to-the-women-in-wapf
What response has Sally made about the accusations leveled against her husband?
This is a serious issue that demands more than just a 3rd-party apology from Dr. Daniel.
Has anything more been done to bring justice or resolution for the victims? Given the #MeToo revelations about people in positions of power abusing their status to exploit others (mainly women, but sometimes men too – ask the men who got the wrong type of attention from actor Kevin Spacey) who have less power/status for sexual gain, this question is still relevant.
But overall, this looks like it could be a pattern. If Sally is in denial about her husband’s behavior, it is not a stretch to suspect that she may also be in denial about FCLO?
Sally’s response? Immediate retaliation against anyone who spoke up. At 2014 Indianapolis conference a victim was so traumatized that she had to be taken by ambulance to hospital.
Sylvia: Thank you for doing the honorable thing. I think FCLO is very dangerous to human health. For some it may take considerable time for the damage to manifest, but manifest it will. I wouldn’t advocate anyone taking any type of CLO except possibly for short-term in the case of clinical deficiency. Easy enough to get vitamin D from the sun and fish, and A from organs, butter and eggs. And a healthy EFA balance from eating fatty fish.
Thanks Gary for your kind words and support. I know I did the right thing.
I have always been concerned about the use of the “fermented” oil in the homemade infant formula recipe. I’ve been in the day care business for 30+ years (my own oldest will be 43 this year, so I’m not exactly a newbie to children’s issues). I’m retiring at the end of August this year. But over the years whenever I gave anyone that “recipe”, I told them to leave out the CLO. Many of them did not want to order it because it was expensive, as far as they were concerned. As it turns out, it was “expensive” in more ways than one.
I do not understand the position taken by tyrant Sally, but hey, she might be peddling dangerous information and everyone I talk to about WAPF is informed about this issue. Many of them still follow some of the nutritional advice there (and they compare it to other advice they’ve been given) but no one I’ve talked to, recently, uses the CLO or FCLO and hasn’t for at least a couple of years or more.
I dropped my membership in 2015.
There are still lots of people using FCLO, even some health-related organizations that recommend/sell it to their members. Earlier this year, Sally was justifying use of FCLO by comparing it to raw milk, saying that FCLO opponents wanted processing of cod liver oil comparable to ultra-high-temperature pasteurization of raw milk.
Yes, David, I’m sure there are still people who use the FCLO and/or the plain CLO. The people I’ve talked to personally, however, have all stopped using it in the past couple of years. I myself never used it because it was so awful I just couldn’t get it past my gullet.
To each his own, I guess.
Dear D. Smith,
Thanks for commenting and for looking out for the welfare of children.
You’re welcome. I felt obligated to pass on that information until more was known, but it seems avoiding the oil is the right thing to do. I just told them to substitute it with good quality butter (local if they could get it) and the babies probably liked it better anyway.
🙂
Thank you for your integrity in all of this. What you did was not easy, I’m sure, same as Dr. Daniel when she left. But I think both of you did the right and necessary thing.
D. Smith: Good to hear from you. I, too dropped my membership in 2015, but attended the Anaheim conference to hear Alan Savory. The horrid drive down there was worth it just for that.
Hi Gary! I don’t get to Dr. Kendrick’s blog as much as I used to, it seems. This summer has been very hectic.
I wouldn’t live in SCA and drive anywhere anymore if someone paid all of my living expenses for the rest of my life! I enjoyed it as a teenager, but now, well, I’m content to live in pure obscurity in the middle of nowhere!!
Dear friends,
I am dedicated to being constructive and promoting all of the wonderful work done by Sally and WAP organization.
This is the one area that is just not possible to support.
We must first do no harm in all that we do.
The epidemiologic evidence is mounting and getting deeper and deeper by the day, month and year and it all focusses on FCLO. There is a list of FCLO consumers ( WAP members ) that are now all dead or dying. These are people that should be living very long and very healthy lives. If FCLO was so great, should have protected them from cancers, heart failure, and other acute illness. Instead these people are dead or dying. The one thing that ties them together is FCLO.
Look at the data and the facts.
The answer is simple, WAP should withdraw its endorsement of FCLO until more is known about the possible risks and continue to concentrate on its otherwise excellent and great work. By the way, there should never be a specific endorsement of a branded product by a non profit. Classes and categories are promoted but not single brands.
I truly wish that this FCLO issue could be put to rest, it is bringing down lives and a great organization. The recent WAP board member that was just diagnosed with serious and rare brain cancer was the last straw for me. She was a very big promoter and user of FCLO. Her name is just the last of a long list of others with the same path. One must keep their objectivity in tact and see the forest for the trees. Epidemiology is data and it is pretty compelling. excuses no longer work.
DO NO HARM! We must only do good and if there is a question…stop until we know more.
Mark
Thanks, Mark, for your support. I agree with what you say… no products should be endorsed by a not-for-profit. As one commenter said very eloquently –if the FCLO was so great, why did it not protect those taking it? As long as FCLO is promoted, this tragic story will continue …And one of the deceased former members of WAPF said he knew the FCLO was rancid, but it was a ” good” kind of rancid. Believe it or not!
That was Rami Nagel. I talked to him face to face for over an hour in 2014 about my concerns about the product. He was selling a lot of it through his book “Cure Tooth Decay.” I told him I planned to investigate as it was clear that Sally and WAPF would not do so. He listened carefully and finally said “Kaayla, I think you are right that it’s rancid. But I know it’s a special sacred form of rancidity.”
A year later I had data from top marine oil labs showing very high levels of Free Fatty Acids, a marker of extreme rancidity. All of the marine oil experts I consulted said they were the highest levels they’d ever seen and represented “end stage rancidity.”
As I wrote in “Hook, Line and Stinker”:
“According to independent marine oils expert Anthony P.
Bimbo, the allowable limit of Free Fatty Acids (FFAs) for
crude fish oil is in the range of 1 to 7%, but typically at 2 to 5%.
The percentage of Free Fatty Acids in FCLO is much higher. One lab reported Free Fatty Acids at 16.2% but another found an extremely high level of free fatty acids at 40.10%. Green Pasture’s own test data as posted on its website also came in high at 19.2% and 25.3%.”
RIP Rami.
What can I replace fclo with? My child has a dental genetic condition where his teeth are frail/brittle and we have relied heavily on this product, as well as the wapf diet. I do not feel safe giving it to him after reviewing your research but I also do not feel safe taking him off the product.
Have you considered the Rosita product? It is offered by Corganic as well as Radiant Life. I have used it with much success after discontinuing the Green Pasture product.
Mark: What data and facts? I know of Dr. Ron and Rami Nagel, but are there others?
Mark, I appreciate and understand your concerns. That said, the majority of us using FCLO have seem great benefit, not harm, in using it. Excessive use is harmful, no doubt (as Dr. Ron himself admitted). Some who have died or are ill have very clear causes to our ailments, such as decades of a SAD diet, deficient maternal and childhood diets, harmful and excessive vaccinations, emotional issues in the background, and… cell phones. This is the major concern of said board member who, like many of us, rely so heavily on our cell phones and keep them plastered to our heads for a significant portion of each and every day. Please, let’s just admit that there is much more potentially at work here than a teaspoon or two per day of FCLO. And, like you, I wish this issue would just stop. Really, David and Kaayla, just let it rest and allow us to make our own decisions. Your desire to bring Sally and WAPF down is quite apparent, and I don’t believe it has everything to do with FCLO. Sally certainly is no tyrant, and the foundation continues to help untold thousands around the world to improve, and recover, health.
Maureen: You are being disingenuous. I needn’t dredge it up, but you know perfectly well why some of us have nothing but contempt for Sally Fallon Morell. In any case, there are vast online resources today which “help untold thousands around the world to improve, and recover, health.” The work of Dr. Price will remain for all time a crucial historical record of the relationship of diet and health, but WAPF has become entirely superfluous, and in my view, as long as Sally is running it, dangerous.
Want to know the truth about what Dr Weston Price really said? Go to the Price Pottenger Nutrition Foundation. ppnf.org If you want to know Sally’s opinions, go to the Weston A. Price Foundation.
Gary etal, Please direct me to the “numerous” incidents of death and injury by FCLO users . I have taken FCLO for a few years now and clearly need to know if there is actual data demonstrating or even suggesting a casual connection between FCLO consumption and injury John
Maureen, No one wants to bring old Sally and organization down. Why would they? As far as I can tell those of us in the trenches last time around were terribly concerned about people poisoning themselves with the rancid cod liver oil. We were trying to save lives, not destroy Sally and her denial of reality. And why take chances Maureen? Really,the stuff smells and tastes rancid and the theory behind it makes no sense scientifically. And why has no other company jumped on the bandwagon and offered competition? And as far as choice, babies do not have that choice when it is in their formula.
You take the risk if you like, but at least stand up for babies being forced to take it.
For the record… “said board member” does NOT keep her cell phone “plastered” to her head “for a significant portion of each and every day.”
To the contrary, I happen to know she is extremely well-educated regarding the dangers of all forms of non-ionizing radiation, and is consistently conscientious about minimizing her exposure.
I’m getting tired of hearing you and Sally’s other puppets saying Dr. Ron stupidly overdosed. He took the 3 tbsp a day — the amount Sally recommended to just about everyone at the time. And he paid a steep price for blindly accepting her “wisdom.”
http://drkaayladaniel.com/too-much-of-a-not-so-good-thing-and-other-questions-about-dosing/
“… if there is a question… stop until we know more.” Seems obvious, doesn’t it Mark? What possible rationale can there be for taking anything other than a conservative approach when dealing with a product surrounded by so much controversy?
It’s not as though there aren’t other CLO alternatives to serve the need in the interim. I understand that a moratorium on FCLO would create financial hardship for the Wetzel family, but surely our community can rally a “crowd-funding” campaign to generate the necessary support while the investigation continues. What’s the alternative?
Longtime FCLO users are becoming morbidly ill, and some have met tragic ends. Correlation may not spell causation, but certainly it justifies a thorough investigation. Who would dare to say otherwise? Moreover, what would be their motive? I almost feel bad quoting the words of our WAPF leader here, as the irony is almost painful, but “follow the money” n’est-ce pas?
Actually, there is a simpler solution than passing the hat for Wetzel. He could just go back to doing what he did before he and Sally got this crazy FCLO idea, which is to sell fresh cod liver oil. He certainly has enough loyal customers who would take his blessings of fresh cod liver oil as a necessary improvement on the “fermented” variety.
Agreed David! Thank you for reminding us that he once had a legitimate product.
Wetzel made millions off the backs of Sally’s loyal followers. His products have been frauds on multiple levels. Cheap pollock oil instead of cod liver oil. Yeah, Sally says cod and pollock are the same thing. Yeah, like it’s okay to pay for lamb and get beef. Butter brought up from Argentina advertised as from happy cows in the midwest. Stupidly high claims for vitamin content. . .
Any collections made should be for the victims and their medical bills. Or burial costs.
I share Ms. Onusic’s concern for the well-being of the WAPF community and applaud her attempt to enlighten its leadership about the highly controversial FCLO product.
My family and company were long-time WAPF members, and remain big fans of Dr. Price’s traditional food philosophy. Our company, Vital Choice, was a major supporter of the annual conferences for more than a dozen years. Having long been immersed in the seafood and marine oils industry, when this story broke we called upon trusted associates in the lipid science community for their opinions of FCLO, which were unanimously critical. One large manufacturer shared that his company had received many requests to produce FCLO, but was unable to figure out how to create a version suitable for human consumption. He said his R & D team conducted trials and reported, “we wouldn’t feed this to a dog.”
We concluded that we could not abide Fallon’s dismissal of the evidence and potential risk to her community, so regrettably withdrew our support.
We are mystified how anyone could continue to recommend a potentially toxic product to its membership…especially one that includes a great many CHILDREN. To date there have been scores of credible people certain they were harmed by this product. Some have even died.
The FACTS are that due to numerous complaints, Kaayla Daniel, the organization’s VP and past recipient of its “Integrity in Science” award launched a serious investigation, ultimately finding that Wetzel had been misrepresenting his product in many respects. Safety issues aside, wouldn’t such community betrayal alone be enough to terminate the sponsorship? If not, why not?
For her display of integrity and commitment to the WAPF family Kaayla has endured character assassination, challenges to her reputation and personal hardship. To my mind her courage and sacrifice has been heroic.
We miss our many friends at WAPF and continue to promote Dr. Price’s philosophy. We also appreciate the positive work Fallon and the foundation still do, but like Sylvia, we are unable to endorse decisions and alliances that we believe continue to put people’s health at risk.
Recently we purchased some Green Pastures Blue Ice “Fermented Skate Liver Oil” and sent it to a lab specializing in peroxide analysis. Their finding: “The skate oil is very oxidized as shown by both hydroperoxides and propanal.” (Propanal is a structural isomer of acetone.)
RIP Dr. Ron Schmit.
Here, here! Kuddos for Kaayla, who’s personal & professional sacrifice continues to shine a light on the path of prudence. Dr. Daniel embodies the “first do no harm” element of that lofty “healer’s oath” and emboldens us all to speak out on behalf of mothers, children and others who may potentially, unwittingly be harmed. As always… caveat emptor.
RANDY its ok we all know Dr kaayla is ELASTIGIRL
SHE UNDOUBTEDLY IS
ALL THE PROFITS JESUS,MOSES,MOHAMMED,NOAH DAVID ETC…THEY ALL HAD CHARACTER ASSINATION
KAALY IS AN INCREDIBLE
BUT I ALSO HAVE TO SAY THAT ALL YOU FARMERS AND CO-OPS AND ANYONE INVOLVED IN BRINGING NUTRIENT RICH DENSE FOOD AND RAW DAIRY TO THE AMERICAN PEOPLE…STICKING UP FOR THE CONSUMERS RIGHTS(LAWYERS,COALITIONS ETC… ARE all
“INCREDIBLES”
I am not “Elastigirl.”
im sorry …thought it was a compliment
Oh, like the superhero? Well, thank you.
yipee …thought you would like that
Thanks, Randy, for the information. I agree that Dr. Kaayla Daniel is heroic and courageous. Sally continues to characterize Kaayla’s results, which came from the best marine and food labs in the field, as “Kaayla’s lies.” However, Sally’s U.K lab results, which she so proudly flaunts as vindication of FCLO, are another untold story in this saga.
Dr Onusic
Please let us know the entire story! The lab that Sally uses is continually brought up as the “gold standard” of why this oil is so good and bioavailable to the body.
The more information out on the rancidity the the better. Sally’s lab should recieve the discrediting it deserves.
(A huge thank you to Kaayla Daniels and to Randy Hartnell for their work with crediable labs. Especially Kaayla for the risks she took with her career and finances to get this information out there.)
Thanks Lilly lil,
I will let you know the entire story in a week or so on my website at drsylviaonusic.com, with a link on my FaceBook and with a comment on this blog. It’s a long saga back to Mary Enig, UBE Labs, Fred Kummerow, Chris Masterjohn and now Martin Grootveld, and even involves me! The saga continues with the latest WAPF fund-raising letter, We are asked to contribute to Dr. Grootvelds’ “research into fat-soluble vitamins.” Even though the letter was certainly prepared before my resignation from the WAPF Board of Directors, I was still surprised to see my name there considering other events.
I actually spoke at one of the WAPF conferences and Sally endorsed my book, but I am no longer a member of WAPF after becoming extremely ill from FCLO. I have lupus and MCS (multiple chemical sensitivities). My worst trigger is rancid oils. I had been successfully using Blue Ice Gold CLO for a number of years. After the introduction of the “fermented” version, I had violent reactions. Responses to my queries were ignored. So sad! They lost my trust and confidence.
I am still astonished that people within the WAPF organization can see the dangers of FLCO, but not raw milk for children. Since 2005, 42 children’s kidneys have been damaged because parents were convinced to believe raw milk was a healthier and safer choice for their children.
This one is for you Mark. A nutritionist told this family to try raw milk for their son’s allergies and now the child is left with permanent brain damage. Those allergies are looking quite minor after what he has been through. The benefits of raw milk do not outweigh the risks.
E.coli 0157:H7 is a game changer for the raw milk movement. It wasn’t a danger in raw milk until it started showing up in our food in the 1980’s. Prior to that raw milk was not a risk for this extremely dangerous pathogen.
http://www.wkyt.com/content/news/487906231.html
To put Mary’s numbers into context, since 2005, there have been 517 reported outbreaks associated with STEC (Shiga-toxin producing E. Coli), resulting in 7,327 illnesses, 1,641 hospitalizations, and 35 deaths.
Eighty-two of these outbreaks have been caused by meat (beef, pork, “other”). Dairy has been responsible for 31 outbreaks. Vegetable row crops, 39. Sources and/or foods unknown, 266.
One of the “dairy” outbreaks was PASTEURIZED cheese, which caused an outbreak involving 135 illnesses and 10 hospitalizations.
If we remove the outbreaks identified as being caused by raw milk, this still leaves 487 non-raw milk outbreaks involving 7,039 illnesses, 1,552 hospitalizations, and 35 deaths.
You can download the data from https://wwwn.cdc.gov/norsdashboard .
Raw milk is not the sole vector for STEC. It is just one of many vectors. When a child gets HUS as a result of eating contaminated beef, we never see “personal stories” reported like this. But it happens all the time with raw milk – and only with raw milk.
Mary M-M. is obsessed with raw milk.
I don’t want to minimize the tragic story of the child who appears to have suffered brain damage as a result of being infected with E.coli O157:H7 in raw milk. But comparing the FCLO problem at WAPF to contamination challenges of raw milk is misleading on several levels. FCLO isn’t a natural product, like raw milk. FCLO is a product left out for weeks with the intention of becoming rancid (and rancidity has been shown to be a health risk in various foods). Raw milk is produced with the intention of being served clean and fresh. FCLO is a product invented in recent years by a single producer. Raw milk has been safely produced and consumed around the world for many hundreds of years. Raw milk has had much worse problems of contamination than what you describe, during the 1800s and early 1900s. Those problems have been mostly eliminated, through modern advances like refrigeration and testing for pathogens, among many others. The threats of today are much less threatening or frequent.
There is no doubt in my mind that the problem of E.coli O157:H7 could be reined in if there was a collaboration of effort by the raw milk, public health, regulatory, and veterinary communities. The raw milk community is doing a fair amount, including the formation and growth of the Raw Milk Institute (RAWMI) and the spread of on-farm testing laboratories used by a growing number of producers. What has been missing is the willingness of the public health, regulatory, and veterinary communities to get involved in a positive way. These communities are mostly stuck in a rigid ideology based on somehow banning raw milk, or else creating so much fear that consumers won’t go near it. Those efforts have failed, yet I don’t see any sign of a shift.
Another way to view the tragedy in Tennessee is to realize that had we had the cooperation over the previous decade of the communities I alluded to, that tragedy might have been avoided.
HI MAUREEN
you have to allways remember
Vera is ELASTIGIRL
SHE WOULD NEVER STEER US WRONGLY
Mary,
You keep using that term, “game changer” when referring to E.coli 0157:H7 and raw milk. Yet, I know that you know that it is not only a “game changer” with respect to “raw milk” but also to an endless list of all foods. So, what do you propose to do about it apart from focusing on this simplistic, legalistic attempt to limit its presence in food?
Indeed, the Kondrtiev Wave principle is applicable to many aspects of life and living apart from the stock market that we should all take heed of… “If one meddles with nature (or a microbe if you will), it (the resulting microbe) can be merciless during the correction”.
Good article here; has to do with one big reason for our recent food contamination problems. Nothing to do with raw milk, however. This is human to human.
Short to read. Click on the “comments” either along the top or at the bottom of the article – some of them are pretty interesting.
https://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2018/07/mcdonalds_tossed_salad_and_toilet_paper.html
Mary, I had asked you once quite some time ago to please post the stats here concerning illesses and deaths from both pasteurized milk (and products) and raw milk (and products). You never did that. Why? I, amongst many others who read here, would appreciate having that information from you and/or your benefactor. Surely you must have some sort of proof bound up in statistics.
What is the status of progress with a cattle vaccine against E.coli O157:H7, i.e. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26104456 ? Has anyone tried in dairy herds, or just in meat herds?
Vera, did we not have this discussion before?
The current vaccine for E. coli O157:H7 is genetically engineered and based on that fact alone one might want to seriously ponder on these words by the late Dr. Mae-Wan Ho Director of Institute of Science in Society…
“Horizontal gene transfer and recombination is a major route to creating new pathogens and spreading drug and antibiotic resistance. There is nothing natural about artificial genetic engineering, which has greatly expanded the scope and accelerated the rate of horizontal gene transfer and recombination. Furthermore, E. coli is the primary bacterium used in genetic engineering. Many new genes and combinations of genes were created and amplified and propagated in E. coli, because the original bacterium was harmless. In the process, genetic engineers have turned an original harmless bacterium into deadly pathogens. The problem is surely that even when you have killed the bacteria, the recombinant (genetic engineered)DNA survives, and can be transferred into living bacteria in the sewage, soil, and water to create new strains”.
vera ,no!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! you like vaccines?? omg and i thought you were ELASTIGIRL.
probiotics are key.yes probiotics for cows,goats,sheep,etc…
do you support an e-coli vaccine ?
if given it will go straight to the lymph system in the cow ,right?
lymph system in the cow is where all the raw milk filters through no??
Groundbeef, I’ll not support it until I’ve seen solid evidence that it works and it’s safe – that’s what I’m asking – has anyone seen this?
Am asking because I’m curious.
Best yet though of course is prevention – i.e. having a solid herd biosecurity plan, RAWMI training and listing, and regular testing. But can more be done to mitigate risk?
Nevermind that of course we’d want to see a vaccine free of heavy metals, mercury, formaldehyde, and all the other poisons which “human-grade” vaccines regularly contain.
And would vaccinating calves prevent E.coli STEC in the resulting adult animals later on?
all of these pathogens can be at different levels vera
in a previous article i had mentioned i was ingesting yogurt and milk from milk that tested positive for listeria
however i never became sick or died…you told me there are 30-40 or 40-50 different listerias the body can handlle without getting even a sniffle….I could not believe this !!!!!.and my immune system is allready compromised…i am old …well not that old and i gave it to a baby under a year old so we broke the mold.anyway testing is ok but i was on the phone with a farmer that sells her milk to whole foods she said that no matter how clean you keep your organic farm there will be poop …and the cows will eat it also while grazing…..but if the guts are in optimum health its good.she told me that there a a few farmers not many that are giving their herd probiotics…so when pathogens engage …they just might not make any difference at all in the milk or meat and then cease to excist.
ken is right all vaccines from what i understand are genetically engineered…super dangerous..and then we drink the milk.uhhh!!
and the cdc says that if your milk is pasturized you will be safe from any vaccine related illenesses carried into the milk.sorry dont think so……. as most vaccines injected have a virus dna attached …hard to wipe out viruses..remember the prions in mad cows disease. we cannot become the SCREENSLAVERS
Yes, Ground beef, there are 17 species of listeria. And they are everywhere. Only two, L. monocytogenes and L. ivanovii, are pathogen. The former is very common, and the latter extremely rare. More at https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4875933. There has only been ONE raw milk outbreak associated with L. monocytogenes, and that was in chocolate milk from Miller’s Organic Farm in 2014.
VERA…L. MONOCYTOGENES. IS WHAT WAS IN THE REPORT FROM THE STATE AS THE TYPE OF LISTERIA….there were many that drank it .so whats going on. why no sicknesses or deaths.
the only thing this farmer did not do was test it independently…he only checked coliform counts .maybe if HE tested it after they came in,instead of relying on just the states answer… he would of found that it was one of the listeria’s that was one of the 15 listerias not serious.We are a bit baffled.next time he is going to (if there is a next time) test independently to see if what the state found he found also.
HI VERA..how does the cow contract this l.monocytogens and l.ivaniianii .is it bacteria or virus.
can it come from water supply ????
hay that is used for winter feeding ??
Raw milk can easily be rapidly tested for pathogens in just 10 hours. That’s the game changer.
Mark
Mark, is that involving an on-farm lab? And, does it include Campylobacter? Our current commercial lab takes from 4 to 5 days to return results for our Campy tests, as they involve a double incubation period. As Campy is part of a suite of tests (along with coliform count, SPC, E.coli, L. monocytogenes, Salmonella), we have to wait this long for the entire test result print-out to arrive.
Mark,
The ability to test for a pathogen is not a “game changer”, but rather a makeshift solution to a deeper problem.
Campylobacter does not create HUS and is considered a very treatable ilness. We test for it as well and it takes longer for results but it is ecoli 0157H7 that is critical.
A person that contacts campy gains immunity for life.
The Tennessee illnesses are a classic example of a state giving freedom to produce raw milk without giving training or responsible standards. This is what you get!
I know this from the McBee dairy incident that occurred just months after Tennessee cow shares were made legal. McBee had not heard of coliforms or pathogens.
After just a few hours of mentoring from RAWMI and McBee started up her own on farm lab using 3M Petri film and she did not have a problem ever after.
Quote from Mark: “A person that contacts campy gains immunity for life.”
Could you please explain to me what this means? Immunity for life – – to what? The reason I ask is because I know a kid right now who has both E. Coli and campy. He is not suffering greatly except that everything goes right through him and he is losing weight. The kid’s parents are not restricting his diet because they want him to eat anything he feels like eating because the outcome is the same! I recommended pure, grass-fed whey protein so he’s been having that for a couple of days now and already seems to be putting back some lost weight and the diarrhea is improving a bit. But I’m curious about the “immunity to campy” statement and where that might fit in for him. Thanks for any answers you can give.
Doctors said he could have picked up these two common bacteria anywhere, probably down at the public fountain where kids run through the water-spraying geysers on really hot days. They think he might have tried to get a drink out of the spout where the sprayed water comes out and lots of little feet, hands and butts have had contact with that spout. I know – gross! Parents refused antibiotics, he’s not hospitalized and he’s finally showing improvement after 3 1/2 days.
Also from what I’ve read and researched in the past few years, it seems clear that HUS can be caused by giving antibiotics to a person who has E. Coli and E. Coli can come from almost anywhere, usually the source is contaminated water. Still, doctors keep giving out antibiotics as if it’s the answer. Well, it does seem to be their only answer . . .
This is a really simple article for people who don’t know much about bacterial infections but want the basics. Certainly you, Mark, probably know more about E.Coli and campylobacter than many people ever hope to know because you’ve studied it at length.
https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/68511.php
I will check back in a couple of days to see if you’ve answered. Again, I would appreciate any info you can give.
I’m just checking back and I see that Mark has not answered the question I put to him. Has Mark been gone and not answered because of that, or why has my question not received an answer?
Does anyone else know anything about this, because I did a couple of web searches and couldn’t find anythng relevant, but I might not be looking in the right places. Gordon Watson – – do you know about the immunity to campy question??
I was hoping Mark would respond. Ah well, I’ll check back again another day.
Hmmm. Apparently no one else knows anything about this subject and I’m still unable to find anything online. For now, I will have to take this statement from Mark as a “mis-statement” and call it a day.
D,
I submitted this comment on August 11-12 but it doesn’t appear to have shown up…
“Analysis of available data clearly indicates that an effective immune system is crucial for the host defense against Campylobacter infection. Innate, cell-mediated, and humoral immune responses are induced during Campylobacter infection, but the relative importance of these mechanisms in conferring protective immunity against reinfection is unclear.”
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2493085/
Recurrent Campylobacter infections do occur however this may very well be due to drug interventions that interfere with the progression of infection and natural acquired immunity…
“Compared to the baseline risk, the risk for a recurrent disease event was higher for a period of four years and followed a decreasing trend. This increased risk of a recurrent event was similar across gender, but higher for people from rural areas and lower for children under four years of age.”
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3025843/
The test is called BAX PCR RT and it is validated by the EU for use on pathogens including Ecoli 0157H7. It takes about 10-12 hours to run including enrichment. It is an off farm lab test. I do not advocate yhe use of pathogen testing on farm. Enrichment of pathgens on farm is a very risky process that invites creation of pathogens from the lab itself. Unfortunately Campy takes longer. We have to use general sanitation as a guideline for Campy.
My point is this. When farmers get training and do some testing, raw milk production becomes very very low risk. Tennessee did not provide training, did not set standards, did not do any testing.
Years ago we had a major back and forth about Freedom verses RAWMI training. Well….here you go. How free does it feel to have a bunch of sick people ? You can earn all the freedom you could ever want if you have clean safe raw milk. First safe…then Freedom.
Ground beef,
Check your story and your sources. There is no raw milk being sold to Whole foods. The last time WF carried raw milk was 10 years ago. They don’t carry raw milk.
Facts are really important.
If anyone wants to see evidence that raw milk be seriously contaminated by pathogens when produced by untrained farmers, here it is, a study by Jayarao and Henning (2001):
# Milk Samples 131 dairy herds
Farm Locations: South Dakota and Minnesota
E. coli STEC: 3.8%
Listeria monocytogenes: 4.6%
Salmonella: 6.1%
Campylobacter: 9.2%
Yersinia enterocolitica: 6.1%
Total % of samples testing positive for pathogens: 26.7%
(Source: Jayarao, B.M. and Henning, D.R. 2001. Prevalence of Foodborne Pathogens in Bulk Tank Milk. Journal of Dairy Science, 84:2157 – 2162)
Meanwhile, the 140 milk samples collected so far from RAWMI-trained farmers in the BC Fresh Milk Project have all tested pathogen-free. (http://tinyurl.com/bcfm-project)
marc….. i never said RAW MILK
read over what i wrote
i just said a farmer that sells her milk to whole foods….
of course its pasteurized silly
marc..make sure you check MY facts before you say i have said something wrong
whole fish were fermented never just fish oil
years ago…people ate and still do eat fermented fish WHOLE
but who will eat the whole stinky fish …norweigians maybe …but not the average folks.fermented cod liver is “trendy”.
maybe the next time anybody is in norway get some of their fermented fish and put it in capsule form
OR LEARN HOW TO FERMENT WHOLE FISH FROM AROUND HERE AND PUT THAT IN YOUR OWN CAPSULES
ground beef,
I assumed raw milk….my bad! Let me eat crow.
Why not use your real name. Use of real names really makes this blog come alive. No one is hiding when we know who we are speaking to.
Anne, Thank you for making the case for good training and reasonable standards for safe raw milk for human consumption verses for pasteurization.
As we gather momentum on the under paid and over supplied dairy debacle and more and more dairies are lost, there will become a time when raw milk will become clearly the winner in the dairy case. Already, OPDC is the number #1 dairy brand of fluid milk ( by dollar volume)in the dairy case at Sprouts in California. More and more consumers are leaving processed milks for raw or dairy alternatives due to the physiologic issues with allergies or digestion of processed milks. We are witnessing history in the making right now and the big processors are very unhappy. The side effects of processing are killing the dairy brand!!
My biggest hope is for some form of “supply management” to take hold for my fellow organic and CAFO dairymen. They deserve far better than a very short milk check, cancelled contracts and a suicide prevention access hot line number.
I beg the dairymen to stand up and take leadership. There are actions being taken right now by NFU and others to stop this madness. Unfortunately, not very many farmers are getting on this band wagon. DO NOT EXPECT YOUR COOP to do anything. You need to stand up for yourself in a community of farmers. Farmers will either kill off other farmers to the point of dairy extinction ( with only huge CAFOS surviving ) or farmers will seize the day and emerge as a force to be reckoned with and set their own prices. There are 39,000 dairies left in the USA. In 1972 there were 650,000 dairies in the USA. Dairies do not leave by choice, they leave from economic duress.
Oath of Commissioned Officers
I ___, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter. So help me God. (Title 5 U.S. Code 3331,
Any US military officer or general worth his stars and or stripes should uphold their sworn commitment and this statement.
We have a huge domestic threat and a Treasonous Traitor. Gitmo is still open just for him.
you must be talking about your pal, Hilary Clinton, arranging to have the majority interest in the uranium resources of the US of A, under control of an agent of the Russian Federation while she was a member of the O’Bama cabinet. Literally selling out her country, for ca$h conveyed to the Clinton “charity”. A moneylaundering enterprise which managed to spend $95 millions on internal administration, whilst dishing out $5 million for genuine charitable purposes.
… or perhaps you’re talking about your gal Hilary, studiously dis-regarding the protections in place for communications within govt. by running her own internet server … absolutely contradictory to stated policy, so that the very safety and lives of US officers were put at risk. Is that what you mean, Mr Mc Affee?
like I always say = stick to the area in which you’re an expert – MILK – and leave-off with your hyperpartisan, idiocy re politics. There is no statute of limitations, for Treason
That charge about the uranium has been debunked by a variety of investigations. Approval of nine U.S. agencies was required to approve the deal, and Hillary Clinton wasn’t part of the process. Take a look at this investigation, as just one example. When are y’all going to be able to let go of Hillary?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/hillary-clinton-uranium-russia-deal/
excellent Qvestion, Mister Gumpert … any day Mark McAffee can get a grip on his-self enough … at the very least … to quit polluting this raw milk forum with his festering bile about PRESIDENT Trump I’ll be very happy to cease responding … same as America was MORE than glad to see the end of Hilary and her consort. There is no statute of limitation on Treason & Guantanamo Base is still there for traitors of the female gender, too.
David,
Who are we to believe? Lying and manipulation it would appear is a way of life for those involved in the geopolitical and business world. The Uranium deal stinks, and the United States Government had to sign off on it. The deal had to have been facilitated by previous US government administrations, including Obama’s.
This New York Times article written back in 2015 states,
“The path to a Russian acquisition of American uranium deposits began in 2005 in Kazakhstan, where the Canadian mining financier Frank Giustra orchestrated his first big uranium deal, with Mr. Clinton at his side.”
“…the ultimate authority to approve or reject the Russian acquisition rested with the cabinet officials on the foreign investment committee, including Mrs. Clinton — whose husband was collecting millions in donations from people associated with Uranium One.”
https://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/24/us/cash-flowed-to-clinton-foundation-as-russians-pressed-for-control-of-uranium-company.html
Thanks for locating this article. It reaffirms that the Clintons were/are financially marginal characters out for their own financial gain. Less clear are the national security issues, which is what the Snopes analysis was getting at, and what the various government reviews were about. The reality is that the Clintons have been out of power for a good while now, so perhaps it’s time to be focusing more on the existing power brokers, and less of the “whataboutisms”.
ok marc go git em…lock him up there
why you waiting for someone else to do it ?
all talk ……and NO ACTION …….JUST LIKE TO SAY THE strong WORDS FROM THE CONSTITUTION BUT YOU NEVER WORK EM.
ALL BARK AND NOOOOO bite ..THATS THE WAY I SEE YOU
https://www.organicpastures.com/blog/increase-breast-milk-supply
In this dark hour, I must share a very bright story about raw milk and breast feeding. My grand kids are a gift from angels. Given what happened at the WTO just ten days ago with this administration trying to blackmail countries into stopping their support of breast feeding, this is particularly timely. When corporate baby formula market share becomes more important than the health of mothers and babies, that is an ominous sign.
https://www.organicpastures.com/blog/increase-breast-milk-supply
In this dark hour, let me share an exceptionally bright story of RAW MILK and BREAST FEEDING. Given what happened just ten days ago at the WTO and the US position to not encourage breast feeding.
http://thehill.com/policy/international/396025-us-turned-to-threats-to-fight-breast-feeding-resolution-report
Compliments to the FDA commissioner for some really solid thinking. “Soybeans and Almonds don’t lactate”. So true. A FDA move going forward to “only allow dairy products to be called milk!” Yeh x 25!!! Its about time! This should have happened 25 years ago. Soy juice and almond mash are not milks and never will be.
https://www.politico.com/story/2018/07/17/almond-lactate-nondairy-milk-scott-gottlieb-725974
And for all those vegans who say babies aren’t calves, they are a lot more like calves than little soybeans! Breast milk is an “animal product.”
YOU GO GIRL…”ELASTIGIRL” THATS RIGHT
VEGAN DIET BY THE WAY IS MAN MADE”TRENDY”DIET
THERE HAS BEEN NO CIVILATION IN HISTORY THAT HAD THIS DIET.But there is one good thing that has come out of this diet lifestyle……..we get better probiotics …why ? because as any good vegan person knows most yogurt cultures and probiotics come from human orgin…(abortion clinics.. human feces…..cadavers….i think even afterbirth that a woman can keep by the way) so they go mostly for plant based probiotics which are good for the gut also.
ground beef,
Who are you? Your choice in commentary begs the question. Why don’t you unvail and reveal. Why hide??
Dr. Sylvia: Thought this article might interest you, if you haven’t already been made aware. I’ve been following this area (adding fake oils to infant formulas) for a while now and it’s a horrible practice, IMO.
This link is to the article regarding “organic formula”, but within the article there’s an embedded link I think might also interest you, called Replacing Mother.
https://www.cornucopia.org/2018/07/u-s-delegation-puts-infant-formula-interests-ahead-of-childrens-health/
**If for some reason the link doesn’t work, let me know and I’ll try posting it again, or go directly to Cornucopia.org and search infant formula – there’s lots of information there.
This is not very happy reading, I’m sorry to say.
D. Smith: Horrifying, but par for the course. Not because of Trump, who is no worse than Obama, Dubya, Clinton, or any of the other idiots who came before them, ad nauseum. As you well know from the David Talbot book, presidents are not in charge. The national security state, whose clients are the super wealthy, have been running the show at least since the Allen Dulles/James Jesus Angleton tag team. This is simply part and parcel of the WHO mandate of population reduction. Not enough to poison all the infants of the world with pharmaceutical products for the treatment of poverty and malnutrition. Not making any of this up. Three good reads: Annie Jacobson’s “Operation Paperclip,” about the many, many Nazi scientists (like decorated and dedicated SS officer Werner von Braun) we brought here after the war; John W. Whitehead’s “A Government of Wolves,” about the police state which was once a constitutional republic; and John le Carre’s “The Constant Gardner,” which, while an outstanding murder mystery, is really about the use of Africans as guinea pigs for pharma, and use them they do, with no accountability, of course.
“This is simply part and parcel of the WHO mandate of population reduction.”
To try to equate the infant formula profiteering with some kind of conspiracy to reduce world population seems a crazy stretch. World population has roughly tripled since 1950, from 2.5 billion to almost 7.5 billion now.
https://www.infoplease.com/world/population-statistics/total-population-world-decade-1950-2050
David: You are correct that the world’s population has grown enormously in the post-WWII period. This is certainly a problem in many ways. What is frightening is the response by the powerful, entirely in the shadows, entirely without the knowledge or acquiescence of those impacted, invariably the poor and marginal. Here is an example of this response: “HCG [an abortifacient and sterility hormone] Found in WHO Vaccine in Kenya. . .”
http://www.oalib.com/paper/pdf/5290033
This vaccine was developed in 1972 under the auspices of WHO, and used in Mexico and the Philippines, as well.
On July 17, 1996, the U.S. Navy, which had been routinely conducting missile tests in the Atlantic southeast of Long Island, accidentally shot down a TWA 747 (flight 800), bound for Paris with more than 200 people aboard, including 53 TWA employees and a group of French foreign students. This was shortly before the Democrat convention, in the first post-blow job election. The Clintons panicked, and within thirty minutes retired to the family quarters with their political operatives to plan a cover-up, while the crisis team met in the situation room below. In an unprecedented action, the FBI and CIA took over the investigation from the NTSB. This has not happened before or since. There were more than a hundred credible eyewitnesses, including the air traffic controller who saw, on his screen, the missile streaking toward TWA800, and a Navy pilot experienced in missile testing, who saw it from the window of his commercial flight. There is overwhelming, unassailable evidence for an accidental errant missile shoot-down of this flight. Also remember that, in 1988, the Navy errantly shot down and Iranian Airbus full of passengers over the Mediterranean. They owned up to it, and paid compensation. As with the CDC and scientific fraud (they know perfectly well vaccines cause autism), admitting the TWA cover-up would open a can of worms which would lead to massive lawsuits and the house of cards would fall. In the TWA800 cover-up, your beloved New York Times was deeply complicit. It is true that sometimes they do very good work, sometimes they publish investigative journalism, although they stonewalled Seymour M. Hersh’s My Lai revelations until they couldn’t any longer. But they cannot be trusted, any more than any of the rest of the media, Fox included, or our government. We are now living in a police state. Lincoln shredded the Constitution, and Cheney tossed it into the fire with the Patriot Act (which Obama renewed and expanded). Deny it if you wish, but we are living in dark times. There are plenty of good, honorable people in the media and government, even the FBI and CIA, but they have families to support , and pensions to think of, so they remain silent, except as anonymous sources. At the management level, and especially political appointees, they are morally corrupt, Trump’s no better or worse than Obama’s or Dubya’s, or any before them.
Dear all,
This madness will stop. D Smith, thank you for posting this link.
Saw a great bumper sticker yesterday…” Any sane adult in 2020 “
All of this business of adding “fake” oils to baby formula has been going on for a long time – 10 years or more, at least. This didn’t start with the Trump administration and that is just a plain fact. I did not post this information so that it could become a political dogfight.
It is the last section of that first article I posted here which contains the information everyone seems to be missing, although few people tend to want to believe ANYTHING President Trump says, and I expected that. Nevertheless, I’m want to post the last part here, for all to see.
*************************
From the Associated Press:
President refutes breastfeeding story
WASHINGTON — The U.S. opposed a World Health Assembly resolution to encourage breastfeeding because it called for limits on the promotion of infant formula, not because of objections to breastfeeding, President Donald Trump tweeted Monday. Trump criticized The New York Times for reporting that U.S. officials unsuccessfully sought to remove language that urged governments to protect, promote and support breastfeeding, along with language calling on policymakers to limit the promotion of food products, such as infant formula, that can be harmful to young children. Trump wrote, “The U.S. strongly supports breast feeding but we don’t believe women should be denied access to formula. Many women need this option because of malnutrition and poverty.” The Times reported that the U.S. delegation embraced the interests of infant-formula manufacturers. Responding to Trump with a tweet of its own, the newspaper said, “Our report is accurate.”
*******************************
And, of course, the NYT has a stellar record of reporting the truth regarding President Trump. Their report might be “accurate” as they claim, but nowhere in the article does the name “Trump” ever appear except to refer to the “Trump Administration”. It simply states that the US delegation is opposed to this or the administration is opposed to that – – – well, what does THAT mean?? What part of the administration are they referring to? I guess it can mean whatever people want it to mean, just like everything else.
This is the link for the Replacing Mother article which I mentioned in my earlier post and it was written in 2009. Who knows how long it took anyone to realize what was happening with baby formula and the fake DHA and AHA oils. That’s anyone’s guess.
https://www.cornucopia.org/2013/06/replacing-mother-infant-formula-report/
Here is another report talking about those fake oils, written in 2011:
https://safbaby.com/false-claims-that-dha-in-organic-and-non-organic-infant-formula-is-safe/
It is the Alpina oil which has always concerned me. The very first time I ever saw that listed in the ingredients on a formula container I was immediately alarmed because I’d never heard of an Alpina fish – and lo and behold, there isn’t one, so it really isn’t a “marine oil” at all unless you use it in your boat, and that would certainly be a better way to use it, too.
If the infant formula container said “Hexane was used in the production of some of the ingredients in this product”, well, then we’d have some real truth in advertising. Didn’t see the NYT mentioning anything about setting the record straight either.
D, you can’t have it both ways–trashing baby formula, yet supporting Trump administration’s efforts to promote baby formula. (BTW, references to “Trump administration” is standard journalistic procedure when multiple people/departments are involved in policy-making. In this case, both State Department and HHS involved in the campaign to sabotage the World Health Association resolution supporting breast feeding. The prez likely didn’t get personally involved, simply because presidents delegate such policy making to subordinates, with proviso that they represent the president’s overall approach, which in this case is to support industry over most everything else.)
You should re-read the original NYTimes report that you are trashing. It reports the Trump administration’s official response to criticism of its efforts to sabotage the breast-feeding resolution: “The Department of Health and Human Services, the lead agency in the effort to modify the resolution, explained the decision to contest the resolution’s wording but said H.H.S. was not involved in threatening Ecuador.
“The resolution as originally drafted placed unnecessary hurdles for mothers seeking to provide nutrition to their children,” an H.H.S. spokesman said in an email. “We recognize not all women are able to breast-feed for a variety of reasons. These women should have the choice and access to alternatives for the health of their babies, and not be stigmatized for the ways in which they are able to do so.” The spokesman asked to remain anonymous in order to speak more freely.”
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/07/08/health/world-health-breastfeeding-ecuador-trump.html
The term “mothers seeking to provide nutrition” really means “mothers seeking to provide formula.” The demand that mothers “should have the choice” means, once again, pushing harder for formula over breast feeding.
The meeting in question happened over two days. So lots of diplomatic jockeying going on, as the article suggests, and sensitivities among diplomats there about being quoted. This is one of the challenges facing journalists, which is hard to communicate to readers like you, who are convinced that somehow the NYTimes and other media go into the event with a preconceived viewpoint (in this case, to trash Trump) they are going to communicate, regardless of what happens. That’s not how it works, I can tell you, having attended and reported on any number of such events.
David: You appear to be one of the people who refuses to believe Trump’s words. The man plainly stated that he supports breastfeeding but he doesn’t feel that the choice for formula feeding should be taken away, either. I don’t know how it could be any more fair than that. Not all women can breastfeed, and that’s a plain fact. But,that’s fine, think whatever you wish.
Here’s the real crux, though. Those who oppose Trump because of his arrogant personality, self-regard, bombast and reflexive counter-attacks against every slight or assault don’t realize that those personality traits are what enable him to fight back. Casper milk-toast GOPe types, like Bush, Romney etc., always roll over and show their soft underbellies to the snarling pack of leftist hyenas. It has never worked. Trump may overreact at times, but the counter-punching reflex must remain intact to survive the horrendous attacks that he faces all-day every-day. I couldn’t do it. Could you?
D, I keep trying to understand the anger that allows Trump supporters like you to rationalize steps he takes that run counter to their own deeply held beliefs, because he is somehow giving it to “the snarling pack of leftist hyenas.” Even after a couple years of him on the national stage, I don’t fully get it.
I personally would like to support him on issues like this, if he really was supporting breastfeeding. If you read the NYTimes article describing the Trump administration’s efforts to sabotage a resolution in support of breastfeeding, it didn’t say, as you suggest, “that the choice for formula feeding should be taken away…” It said that breastfeeding should be encouraged as a first choice. Of course formula feeding should continue to be available. What the Trump administration is advocating when it talks about “choice” is a return to the old days when formula companies went around the globe offering free samples and other incentives to encourage poor women to abandon breastfeeding entirely.
Could I survive “the horrendous attacks” he faces? I’m not sure what you mean. I think he gives as much, or more, than he gets. Just read his twitter feed each day. Just today, he went after journalists (again, “corrupt media”), Amazon, Hillary Clinton, Robert Mueller, the judges who approved investigation into Carter Page for possible spying, and Iran (in all caps, “YOU WILL SUFFER CONSEQUENCES THE LIKES OF WHICH FEW THROUGHOUT HISTORY HAVE EVER SUFFERED BEFORE.”) That’s just one day, and I don’t think I’ve covered it all.
I give him credit for cleverness. He understands that his attacks on people and institutions you have so long hated give you such great pleasure you don’t even care when he does things that you would ordinarily find reprehensible.
your final paragraph, Mr Gumpert, shows that you’re finally ‘getting it’ … Trump / his handlers found out the depth of the visceral hatred white Americans have, for those who betrayed them = that being ; the pack of lapdogs in the newsmedia who are absolutely owned by interests inimical to the nation. PRESIDENT Trump is dishing back to them, the insult white people have suffered for a generation from the enemies of the REpublic, ie crypto and not-so-crypto commies. Sure, he comes off as a bombastic Bull-in-the-China shop of political correctness, but he’s OUR Bull in this bullfight. Long past time those precious lib-tard sensibilities got trashed. He’s succeeding because he has THE prime pre-requisite for a leader ; a high level of testosterone. Enjoy the show while it’s being televised live, because Donald Trump is NOT here for the long game. Apres The Donald cometh le deluge.
if you can receive it = insight for understanding what moves Trump supporters is set out in a short article at this URL
https://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews/politics/item/25864-cia-s-mockingbirds-and-ruling-class-journalists
On October 30, 1993, the Washington Post published a stunning column by its ombudsman, Richard Harwood. Entitled “Ruling Class Journalists,” Harwood’s article was an extraordinary admission against interest coming directly “from the horse’s mouth,” so to speak. His startling and completely unexpected disclosure (which was probably intended more as a boast than a confession) vindicated the claims long made by this magazine and its predecessors (American Opinion and The Review of the News), to wit, that America’s “Establishment,” as represented by the world government-promoting Council on Foreign Relations (CFR), had secured a virtual monopoly over our nation’s “mainstream media,” the MSM.
true or not, this quip sums up what white folks believe of ‘ruling class journalists’ = “Washington Post owner Philip Graham is reported to have said he was told by a CIA operative that members of the press were easier and cheaper than prostitutes. “You could get a journalist cheaper than a good call girl, for a couple hundred dollars a month,” the Company man told the Post man.
Trump does well as President, because = relentlessly = he calls out the domestic enemies of the Republic
Irrespective of the ruling political party in the US, the pharmaceutical and agribusiness industries make a point of ensuring, that their interests are supported and adopted by government “administrations” as strategic and commercial imperatives that in turn is forcefully implemented around the world via your countries long standing imperialistic policies.
“US force feeds GM crops to African nations, says new report”
https://www.foei.org/press/archive-by-subject/food-sovereignty-press/us-force-feeds-gm-crops-african-nations-says-new-report
“The US administration’s strategy consists of assisting African nations to produce biosafety laws that promote agribusiness interests instead of protecting Africans from the potential threats of GM crops,” said Haidee Swanby from the African Centre for Biosafety, which authored the report commissioned by Friends of the Earth International.”
“US targets EU over GM crops”
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2011/jan/03/wikileaks-us-eu-gm-crops
“In response to moves by France to ban a Monsanto GM corn variety in late 2007, the ambassador, Craig Stapleton, a friend and business partner of former US president George Bush, asked Washington to penalise the EU and particularly countries which did not support the use of GM crops.
Both of the above incidences including the latest infant formula event are indicative of a deep-rooted rot in American politics that keeps repeating itself throughout the course of Her history irrespective of the President or the party in power. This rot has unfortunately infected the mainstream media as well and represents a real problem for your country.
The American people voted for Trump because they saw him, despite his faults, as the best option; not the perfect or idealistic option, for reigning in the above ongoing rot in Washington. Hopefully they won’t be proven wrong on too many counts.
I am not angry, David, I’m frustrated by people like you and your ilk who just refuse to understand that not everything is purely black and white. There’s a lot of gray area and sometimes we must just wait a bit for things to “develop” – – not everything happens according to your plan or any plan other than that of the President’s timing.
I do not read trash like the NYT and I certainly do NOT
depend on sites like snopes to give me my “fact checking information”.
You don’t know me, have never met me, and yet you seem to know exactly how I feel and what I “hate” and why I’m “angry” etc. I don’t understand that kind of behavior, that’s for sure.
As a follow-up to Gordon’s The New American link, this article https://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews/politics/item/25858-obama-s-big-brother-nudge-squads explains the basis for why anything the media says about President Trump is highly suspect.
by the by…babies don’t need formula
keep it simple…If you can’t nurse for whatever reason
raw fresh goats milk is number one
or cow milk….add an egg yoke raw and some honey when they get to the 6 month mark…. or just keep milk plain.warm it up just a tad bit…to release the tryptophan and your good to go
BABIES CAN THRIVE AND GET REAL PLUMP From JUST THIS
I KNOW…. I HAVE TRIED IT ON ALL OIF 4 OUT OF 5 OF MY GRANDKIDS.
NOT SURE WHEN FORMULA STARTED TO BE IN EXCISTANCE.BUT I LIKE TO KEEP IT SIMPLE.
bearing in mind that, when feeding goats’ milk / cow’s milk to a nursing baby … make sure to get that milk in to the child as soon as possible after it’s taken from the cow/goat. in his classic book “Goat Milk Magic” Dr Bernard Jensen’s opinion was : there is an “electrical component’ to fresh milk which dwindles within hours.
interesting gordon…id say this should be true.glad it could be…allways got my milk from the goat the lear was 11 hours aftyer it was milked.i guess if i had a farm that would even been that much better.
dr.bernard jensen had some good thoughts.he had alot of kids and grandkids so he had lots of hands on expierance with how foods reacted to children.is this the same Jensen that wrote the book something “bowel” health ?
Raw milk should not be given alone to babies. Instead it should serve as the key ingredient in an infant formula recipe designed to replicate breast milk as closely as possible. Baby cows, goats, camels and other mammals, after all, differ from human babies. Though all mammalian milks contain the essential components needed to nourish the baby’s developing body and brain, the ideal levels and the ratios of those ingredients will be different for each type of baby. The Price Pottenger Nutrition Foundation will soon be posting science based recipes on its website. Dr. Sylvia Onusic and I are both involved. Stay tuned.
ive got science based right here dont need to look any further.my proof is in what and how these kids thrived and gained an incredible amount of weight.heard too many stories from people i know on how goat milk ALONE was all they had the first year or so..when my grandkids reached 4 or 5 or 6 months honey and pollen was added then a raw egg yoke…however one grand child could not even have the goat milk she got bound up.did i ask the doctor how this could be remidied??? no. I asked the farmer …his wife said add a little goat kefir to the milk.then digestion was easier.I think FORMULAS are a trendy thing also.Im going to try and find out WHEN what point in history they were introduced to the general population..they had a complete meal with the egg yoke,pollen and honey and milk in one shot…sometimes i would re-introduce some goat cream back into the container of milk so it was creamier..but not too much
The electric component found in really fresh raw milk could be ILC. Newly discovered this Innate Lymphoid Cell is found in breast milk but is lost after refrigeration. This cell regulates other immune cells and can be considered the general that commands the other forces that fight and protect babies immunity process. The reason this cell remained hidden this long was because it did not stain like the other protein markers that identified other white blood cells and immune blood cells. It remained unstinted and hidden.
Fresh direct breast milk has hidden treasures for both moms and babies. Nourish the mom with plenty of raw milk as she breast feeds her baby…then when mom weans the baby, its more raw milk from other mammals for the baby. Nothing like 15,000 years as proof of the brilliance of this raw milk then more raw milk nourishing tradition.
Today was a very good day at OPDC. After two lawsuits, 14 years of fighting, three settlement agreements and more than $3 million in payments, OPDC was officially welcomed into the CA FMMO 51. That’s the federal milk pool order 51. That is code for the new California Federal Milk Marketing Order. The FMMO took eight years, an act of congress four years ago, a vote of all CA dairies and a miracle to make this conversion from the CDFA milk to the FMMO.
Today, representives of the USDA FMMO market admin office visited OPDC, took a tour and provided an orientation on the paperwork. We are exempt!!!
This is a dream come true. For the last 18 years, OPDC was forced to pay huge assessments into the CDFA milk pool. The largest assessment was in excess of $50,000 for one month. This was an assessment that was levied on OPDC for using its own milk….that’s right, OPDC had to pay into a milk pool when it used its own milk!!! Talk about an outrage.
Those assessment dollars were provided to large CAFO conventional dairies that sold their milk to make cheese. When OPDC demanded to know where our funds had been spent, CDFA refused to provide that information.
I considered this totally unjust because ” consumer dollar voting” that voted for organic and raw, was being sent to GMO, antibiotic using, conventional CAFO operations. Not to mention that OPDC could not ever equally participate in the milk pool. OPDC was limited to only raw products and could not make ice cream and many other products. Lastly, for food safety, OPDC could not bottle other dairies milk….only our own.
The assessments were totally unfair. One judge told us, he agreed it was unfair but he refused to change law from the bench, and suggested that we change state law instead of litigating. Well, I became totally engaged ( along with others ) and we changed state law!!! Through federal action. It took years and we overcame the extreme economic burdens of the oppressive CDFA milk pool.
When we tried to pass state law, guess who showed up in opposition? the big dairies that loved to receive our assessment checks. It was legalized financial rape. Nothing less. They insisted on continued economic subsidy sent by OPDC !!!
I am so happy. Our day has finally come. Our work has finally paid off. I let our friends at the USDA FMMO know how happy I am to work with them in an equitable system.
The next step for our future is a system of a dairyman controlled national milk inventory management system. We are having conference calls every week on this. Dairies are signing up all over America for the program. We are calling it SMIS. Sustainable Milk Inventory System. It will cost the tax payer zero and place the control of milk inventory and price into the dairymen’s hands on a regional basis.
With a loss of 93% of US dairies since 1975, SMIS time has come ( from 650,000 down to 39,000 today ). Now is the time for US dairies to change culture. Change from a culture of wanting your neighbor to fail , to one of collaboration instead of economic canabalism.
With huge numbers of farmer suicides, cancelled contracts and deep pain from oversupply and resulting below cost payment, the time is ripe for change. Political change only happens with deep pain. We have that now in the broader industry.
OPDC is Blessed to be consumer connected and RAW. This has insulated it from much of this pain, but not all. We feel it as well. We have lost contracts for our excess organic skim milks. That extra skim gets sold to a neighbor to feed calves for 35 cents per gallon. When you enjoy butter,….that skim had to go somewhere. Ouch. We used to get $35 per CWT. thanks to cheating CAFOs out of state that don’t pasture their cows, organics has taken a huge hit. SMIS has an organic component as well.
Times are changin!! But only because we are forcing change. It is time for all farmers to unite and stand together. Processors won’t do it, they love cheap milk. It will be farmers that make this change happen.
The CA FMMO was farmer led, SMIS will also be farmer led.
Today was a very good day. Now we fight for better days ahead for all dairies not just vertically integrated “PD exempt” raw dairies. I helped draft the SMIS program and so far dairymen and coops including Land O Lakes love it !! To build a powerful, farmer centered national consensus, that’s our next step. Its going down right now.
Congratulations, Mark…..for pursuing your case through an opaque system of regulation, and for winning.
Kudos to Mark for persistence and success.
David, I wanted to reply to the comments by Gordon and Lynn_M regarding integrity of the media, but there is no reply button?
So I’ll leave my follow up here:
http://www.umass.edu/magazine/summer-2018/fake-news
UMass experts cast a clear eye on fake news and our disorienting media landscape.
By Laura Marjorie Miller
““Who is ‘the media’ anyway?” he asks impatiently—and asks us to ask ourselves. “The phrase has been so overused as to mean almost nothing.” In this new information landscape, we are all the media, each one of us an information propagator. Users are more than just consumers; we are now creators. And with our new sophistication and sphere of influence comes responsibility: in this case, that we become more responsible for making sure the information we share is accurate.”
Yes, Congratulation Mark,
I don’t mean to be cynical; however, when it comes to a milk marketing system experience tells me to be leery… Your battle is not over it has merely transitioned into a new and different phase. It would be a mistake to think that CAFOs and processors are going to willingly capitulate to your “forced change”.
My hat is off to you, Mr McAffee and the team at Organic Pastures. You can’t argue with success
In order to get a grip on what you’re in for next, I recommend you study the pages at
http://bcdairyhistory.ca/PDFs/OUR+FIRST+50+FVMPA+1917+-1967.pdf
Being ; a sentimental journey relating the first 50 years of the Fraser Valley Milk Producers association… lots of charming photos … ( including one from 1910 with my grandfather Jas. Turner in it) … worthwhile as Lessons Learned = what happens when farmers band together to cope with Big City processors / distributors who were treating them unfairly. It is especially important to you for explaining how the laws passed by the Province of BC for controlling milk production/ marketing, were repeatedly ruled UN-constitutional ( right up to the Judicial Committee of the Privy Council in England, the very top of the British Empire Courts ) at the same time the Supreme Court of the US of A ruled that the National Recovery Act was un-constitutional in your country
The FVMPA lasted half a century … changing its brandname to “Dairyland” circa the 1960s. Point being = today, in Burnaby British Columbia, one of the most modern milk processing plants in the world – dreamed-of, capitalized and built with the blood sweat and tears dairymen – is owned by Saputo = a global corporate giant = head office of which is half-a-world-away
Thus endeth my sermon for today
… … …
A letter to the Editor by Joseph Schaafsma, professor emeritus ( economics ) University of Victoria
Dairy policy costs consumers
Re : American whining about much a-moo about nothing. Opinion June 27
Wendy Holm claims in her column that “supply management is good agricultural policy”. Facts she does not present suggest otherwise. Canada’s dairy quota system limits the daily supply of butterfat below the free market level and pushes up the price of dairy products ( bad for consumers ).
This quota has a market price ( $/ kg of butterfat produced per day ) that ranges from $22,999/kg in New Brunswick to $38,500 /kg in B. C. Potential new entrants interested in starting a small family farm are frozen out by these high upfront quota costs ( about $4 million for approximately 100 cows in B. C. ) while efficient farms ( large industrial-sized farms ) can afford to buy quota and still make money.
Over time, our quota system has contributed to the decline of the family farm and the emergence of the industrial farm. The quota system and its strict controls also stifle innovation in the dairy industry and limit the range of specialty dairy products.
Canada should end the dairy quota system and open up its dairy market in exchange for access to world markets. Canada’s wine industry took off with NAFTA; our dairy industry can too.
Letters to the Editor Vancouver Sun July 21 2018
Congratualtions Mark, about time!!
CAFOs are dying as we speak. The oversupply conditions does not leave CAFOs immune. Congressman David Valedao is losing his dairy after years of losing money, RABO bank pulled his loans.
We have a non system yet we expect dairy cases in stores to carry dairy products.
I do agree, processors will hate this program, because they will finally become “price takers”.
There is a very good chance that dairies will not be able to change culture and the onslaught will continue. I don’t want to be a part of this. I want to die trying hard along with others doing the same. At least the future for OPDC will be fair and gives me a basis to fight from.
I am dedicated to an equitable dairy system for all dairies. American farmers, our cows, our communities, our environments, our consumers and our next generations deserve better. Cream checks that under pay coming along with suicide hot line help numbers is insanity….truly insane.
Mark,
The concentrated animal feeding operation (CAFO) approach is akin to a socialist, collective farming approach. Governments and greedy individuals in capitalist nations have respectively endorsed and adopted the collective farming strategy in order to cheapen and monopolize food production. In Canada thanks to government mandated milk marketing boards CAFOs are alive and well and a growing phenomenon at the expense of small family farms. As the article Gordon referred to points out, only “large industrial-sized farms can afford to buy quota and still make money”. And to cap it all off, thanks to draconian milk regulations that the marketing board system in turn endorses and promotes in Canada, consumers are compelled to purchase only pasteurized milk…
I couldn’t agree with you more, “farmers, our cows, our communities, our environments, our consumers and our next generations” do indeed “deserve better”. That however will not happen until consumers adopt a greater appreciation for quality food and are likewise willing to fork out a greater percentage of their disposable income for that food… the amount of wasted food is a testimony to the above fact. As the following Atlantic article states, Americans (including Canadians) waste an unfathomable amount of food. In fact, according to a Guardian report released this week, roughly 50 percent of all produce in the United States is thrown away—some 60 million tons (or $160 billion) worth of produce annually, an amount constituting “one third of all foodstuffs. Wasted food is also the single biggest occupant in American landfills, the Environmental Protection Agency has found”.
https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2016/07/american-food-waste/491513/
And what causes this the article asks??? “A major reason is that food is cheaper in the United States than nearly anywhere else in the world…” thanks to longstanding government cheap food policies. “Forcing” processors and consumers to pay more for milk nurtures animosity rather then respect.
Ken,
I am curious. What part of the Canadian system of supply management does not work? Farmers run the system through regional boards and they set fair prices. Farmers are provided quota in order to assure that over production does not occur and supply matches demand. Canada has had growth and its dairies thrive with out government hand outs. They get $27 per cwt when we get half of that with processors loving it.
There are no farmer suicides in Canada.
In the USA farmers are paid below cost and the system loves it. Processors make the money off the backs of dairy farmers that work until their equity runs out or they die.
If raw milk was allowed in Canada as provided by the Cottage Industry Quota system, what would be wrong with the Canadian style management of milk production ?
Canadian dairymen retire rich. They don’t get forced out. Young farmers don’t start in the USA either. That is a fact of economics. It costs millions to buy ground and cows and build dairies. At least in Canada, the prices received are fair If every young farmer could build a dream dairy there would be massive over production. Pick your economic reality.
I am very interested in what elements would make the Canadian model better. Please share. I am listening. On August 13th I will be in Albany NY representing all CA dairymen at an Agrimark Coop conference. There will be a big gathering of dairymen to discuss a better system for US dairies. CA has developed a plan and I will be presenting it and trying my best to gather interest and support.
One thing is for sure…..the Wisconsin dairymen have been too damn nice. It is time to stand up and be strong and lead ourselves out of this darkness with a dairymen based plan. No handouts or subsidies.
A US dairymen led comprehensive “system of inventory and price management” pays for and sustains itself.
Looking for ideas….please send them my way.
Hi Mark! In my opinion, the dairy supply management system in Canada was a good idea to begin with, but went bad once quota could be sold as a commodity for profit, and used as collateral for bank loans. At the beginning, when farmers were given quota for free or next to nothing, it was a licence to produce, but nothing more. Then it became a commodity and suddenly all these dairy farmers became owners of high-value assets, which they had originally obtained for free.
Meanwhile, the milk marketing boards still insist that quota has no financial value – the BC government and the BCMMB still insist that htis is the case. Nevermind that to purchase quota today on the exchange would cost me $38,500 per cow ($41,020 if I lived in Alberta) – see http://www.dairyinfo.gc.ca/pdf/quota18_e.pdf
So, my suggestion to you and other U.S. farmers is to ensure that quota doesn’t become a tradable commodity. That it remains simply a licence to produce X amount of product.
look ! as I’ve explained repeatedly on this forum : The milk supply quota racket is an invention of the Fabian society Progressive Economic Plan, from Day One ; communism. Every country which tried it, over half a century, has rejected it. In Canada, it’s all over but the weeping+ wailing being done now, by vested interests. As I predicted a decade ago when we started Home on the Range raw milk cowshare = the quota thing is such an embarrassment that the govt. has to ‘throw money at it’ to make the problem go away.
What’s wrong with it? Farmers are beholden to the Banksters. Consumers are compelled to purchase milk products which have had the goodness stolen out of them because all the milk in the supply system has to be par-boiled. The entire fluid milk retail distribution is predicated on a 30 day shelf-life for “homo milk”. A model allowing artisanal dairies with a 7 day shelf-life for REAL MILK, would utterly upset their economic “apple-cart”… going right to the wicked heart of the whole God damned thing = USURY
as I explained the other day : the history of the Fraser Valley Milk Producers Association tells you everything you need to know, about how the milk business went from being a vital part of the supply of NUTRITION, in which producers were payed what they deserved, to the officially-imposed scheme of “serfdom with a benign face” that we have today. It’s been 40 years since Canadians have tasted REAL MILK because a critical part of the dairy supply racket, is : dumbing-down the quality of the milk to the lowest common denominator. Canadians are sold the Image of milk, rather than the REAL THING. And that did not come about just by accident. There are evil people in this world who get up in the morning and go to work, gloating as they harm the white race, any and every way they can. Stealing the very nutrition out of the mouths of our children, is part of that wickedness
The Dairy Farmers of Canada has a lobbying budget of $100M – yes million – per year. With this type of money, I don’t think that the supply management system in Canada is going to disappear any time soon. One processor has gone on record that it should be ended, but no farmer that I know is interested in the system being dismantled.
The DFC already got their man, Andrew Scheer, in as the Conservative Party of Canada leader, winning over Maxime Bernier who had the guts to come out against supply management. If they have the political power to set who is the Leader of the Official Opposition in Canada and likely the next Prime Minister, they aren’t going anywhere soon.
Mark,
If you go back to the comments I made on David’s blog over these last few months you will find the answer to all of your questions.
The marketing board system is the product of an opposition to the unbridled workings of the economic market. It is about control and manipulation… and it is equally and especially vulnerable to being controlled, manipulated and corrupted. It is not the magic bullet you make it out to be.
You ask, “What part of the Canadian system of supply management does not work?”
Supply management “works” within the framework that it is designed. Your question should read, “What part of the Canadian system of supply management is (counter productive)”.
(1) The small cream producers were more or less hung out to dry…
(2) Diversity of product was undermined and lost…
The Channel Island breeds lost their exclusive, thriving markets that they worked hard to developing. Milk was Milk so the marketing board claimed and as a result was mixed together and sold with no distinction to breed source. Battles raged between the Jersey produces who advertised and sold jersey milk as a separate product and for which there was a strong demand, and the Holstein Friesian producers, whose black and white elephants were inefficiently producing large volumes of milk that they couldn’t sell. In the end a compromise (albeit halfhearted) was reached whereby a price differential was agreed upon based on total solids, mainly butterfat and protein. Milk from the different breeds however continued to be mixed together and sold as one.
(3) Small family run dairy farms once the backbone of rural communities are disappearing…
Today thanks to supply managed marketing board policies that cater to economy of scale practices, rural communities have suffered economically due to the huge decline in the number of small dairy farms and the many businesses that served and supplied them.
(4) Putting a dollar value on quota…
As I previously stated, “For those dairy farmers in Canada that had milk quota (a non asset) given to them and then turned around and sold it 30-40 years later for millions of dollars, on top of the value of their livestock and land are no doubt wealthy individuals with a healthy nest egg. That was a short-term gain at someone else’s expense; namely, todays younger farmers in Canada who are compelled to pay those millions of dollars so they can produce milk!”
Classifying quota as a retirement asset is ludicrous and the fact that a select and limited number of individuals are making a healthy profit borders on usury and therefore unconscionable…”
(5) Aggressively apposes the sale of raw milk…
Michael Schmidt, has approach and attempted to communicate with the milk marketing board to no avail.
i think gordon is right guys and girls