The television show “20/20” did a segment last Friday about the use of steroids by athletes. Ho hum, I thought. Another of those slam jobs on professional baseball players using performance enhancers.
But before long, I was paying close attention, because the host, John Stossel, was saying that steroids aren’t nearly as dangerous as they’re made out to be. You know all those stories about teenage steroid users committing suicide? There apparently is no data to back that up. It’s not as if steroids are without risk. But the risks may be overstated by public health officials.
At one point, Stossel says, “Why single out steroids…We allow people to eat junk foods.”
Then a body builder type interviewed at a health club states, “So what, it’s my body.”
Stossel concludes by raising the obvious question: If steroids are so dangerous, “Where are the bodies?”
Well, you know what’s going through lots of our minds. Stossel might just as well have been doing a story about raw milk. Except, of course, raw milk actually has more health benefits, and probably fewer health risks, than steroids.
That 20/20 story is actually one of the few by the mass media to actually question the fear and hysteria that seems to be running rampant through our society, and getting worse, if that’s possible.
There’s been that swine flu pandemic that faded out almost as quickly as it appeared. I even saw something on television featuring “the most terrible mom”—a New York City mother who had the gall to allow her nine-year-old son to ride the city’s subways alone. Doesn’t she know enough to be terrified to let her young son have some old-fashioned independence?
There’s that front page New York Times article, “Outbreaks Put Worry on the Table” featuring three people who became ill from consuming various foods,, including one in CA (the Del Norte County case I referred to in previous post) who became very sick.
The answer: more bureaucrats to tell us more things we can’t eat or can’t do.
No, I think Don Wittlinger has it right, as he emphasizes time and again: it’s about rights, first and foremost. Once you lose the right, it’s nearly impossible to get back. Right now, there are efforts brewing in a growing number of states to get back the right to distribute raw milk—in New Jersey, Tennessee, and in Vermont (to expand the sales opportunities for farmers). We should have the right to take steroids if building our muscles is what’s important. It may not be my thing, but I respect it as the right of others. But the more inspectors we hire to pass the restriction kool aid, the more distant will our rights become, and the harder they will become to win back.
Feed the masses toxins. There are many man-made toxins. I envision the mad scientists dropping the beaker and spreading the pig flu……. Things tptb says are "safe’
http://www.vancouversun.com/Life/Authors%20discover%20toxins%20shelf%20products%20increase%20quickly/1582337/story.html
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=afrdATVXPEAk&refer=worldwide
Montrose Dairy Reopens 3 Weeks After Closure Over Raw Milk "CONCERNS"
by Sentinel Staff 5/12/09
No smoking gun found [oh well they tried] case closed. And where did that farmer hide all those bad campy germs perhaps under his finger nails?
Farmer looses 3 weeks of income and "only" 1% of his customer base!
And the public was protected again!
Please forgive my sarcasm again.
http://www.gjsentinel/hp/content/news/stories/2009/05/12/051309_3a_Montrose_Dairy.html
It is very interesting to me that the U.S will allow the sale of a product shown over and over and over again to be detrimental to your health. It’s a known FACT that smoking is horrible for you. However, raw milk gets treated like a product worse than cigarrettes.
Back to the point – sometimes people do not know how to make good decisions on what to put into their body, so the gov’t comes in to regulate it (no sales under age 18, 21, etc). I think there’s a fine line between what should and shouldn’t be regulated. I also think that if something is going to be regulated en masse by the government, there better be a LOT of studies and a lot of time and research showing this to be something that indeed, needs regulation. I don’t think raw milk falls into this category.
What you have touched on in this post is the crux of true freedom and liberty. Everyone wants to be free to do what they want, but are concerned about what others are up to and desires other folks behavior to be regulated for their own safety. To be free, you must be willing to accept other peoples bad personal decisions.
Jennifer B,
Not trying to be critical, just for your consideration – please bear in mind the only reason we (the public) pick up the tab is through taxation and government involvement in healthcare. The problem there is not the individual behavior, but government meddling. In a free society, folks would pay (or profit) from their own decisions. Anytime we say "sometimes people do not know how to make good decisions", we open the door for tyranny. I believe it doesn’t matter if people know how to make good decisions, only that they are allowed to fully experience the consequences of their decisions. Then they will learn.
Unintended consequences are rampant in government policy. In an effort to cast a safety net, they make us infinitely less safe.
My two cents.
Years ago prior to gov. interefence in the health care system most people had affordable private medical insurance and very little restrictions on choises of treatment and I dont remember people becoming bankrupt via a medical crisis. The health care system was not 16% of GDP then as it is now with gov. involvement there is no incentive to be concern about cost its just another signed blank gov. check. Rather just more IOUs from many future unborn generation and they have no voice in their future at this time. Financial child abuse maybe?
This can not continue we are already broke [simple 5th grade math] . What is the answer I dont know I do know that it is not more of the same big gov. that brought us to this point.
Only hope I might offer consume real food and real raw dairy its worked for me so far and I have no doctor and no doctor bills and take no pills none.
After your link failed, I goggled using these search words: gjsentinel montrose dairy. When I clicked on the google hit, the story came up. Looking at the URL listed in google, there are 2 lines, and I suspect you left out the second line in your URL. The full URL is:
http://www.gjsentinel.com/news/content/news/stories/2009/05/12/051309_3a_Montrose_Dairy.html?cxtype=rss&cxsvc=7&cxcat=7
Thanks for posting the story. I had wondered what was happening there.
The Fresno Mayor made a very nice speech announcing how important "whole food" purchased directly from farmers is to the health of Fresnos citizens.
The eye brows were a bit raised by the health department agency reps that stood by to supervise the ribbon cutting ceremonies as raw milk was being sampled by Fresno Police department bicycle officers and literally 50 more people.
The old saying that "half of winning is just showing up" is so true. Today just showing up was more like 95% of winning. OPDC was interviewed by two local TV stations and got one on one time with the Mayor. Our mayor Ashly Swearingen loves what the Farmers Market means to the health of Fresno and its citizens.
Let this be a lesson to everyone….just show up….and be counted and the paradigm in charge will have to acknowledge you. Today we were praised because we were a substantial part of the draw for the market.
What draws real people to the Farmers Market is not what the health department, FDA, DHS or CDFA would like to think draws people to the farmers market. It is a grand disconnect in high theater.
I love raw milk and what it does to "change everything".
Just show up…get the interview…feed the people….be the change!!
Mark
Do these people not have health insurance? How are "we end up picking up the tab" for their healthcare?
Or is this the same as home owners insurance where when the homes burn in So Cal or there is a disaster elsewhere, mine will go up even though I did not have any claims? I am penalized for another’s misfortune. If this is so, then shame on anyone who becomes deseased/injured as then "we end up picking up the tab for thier healthcare". I’ve known many who developed lung cancer who’ve never smoked nor been around it, asthma falls under COPD. Are we picking up the tab for all those kids with asthma?
"I believe it doesn’t matter if people know how to make good decisions, only that they are allowed to fully experience the consequences of their decisions. Then they will learn."
I think this is a major problem in our society, consequences for actions/choices are not always experienced and actions are habitual with no repercussions from those responsible.
U of IL Genome Map
http://www.wisconsinagconnection.com /story-national.php?Id=1049&yr=2009
HMMM "We now have "genetic" maps that reveal the "gene" responsible for the "genetic diseases" that plague the beef and dairy INDUSTRIES"
Perhaps now they can do a study on the diseases that plague the dairy industry cows in the CAFOs standing 24/365 hoof deep in their own filthy waste material and eating cow junk phood and never ever placing a hoof on one blade of green grass.
Has Academia bred out of most scientists the gene responsibile for common sense?
This is good news tho we no longer have to FEAR the pathogens and BAD germs the GENES did it! BOO!!! Gota be a little bit humor there somewhere EH?
double click on the url then rightclick then copy. then come here right click and paste.
if you’re click/draging and the desired link spans 2 lines then the pasted link will have a space where the url breaks for the next line.
till you figure out what is wrong, after pasting the link in your post look it over for the missing dot or the unwanted space and manually add/delete the offending character.
hope this helps
Don,
According to the best leading scientsists like Bonnie Bassler at Princeton and others about 85% of the human genome is not human at all….it is found in the bacteria that inhabit our bodies.
So it is the bacterial DNA we have to blame 85% of the time…. so change the bacteria and we change the genetic code. It is very convenient to blame everything on DNA but that excuse will soon not be available when people start to get it that 85% of the genetic information that makes us mammals is in the bacteria.
Thats why bacteria is so critical to life and yes….even genetics.
Seed in the good bacteria ( probiotic food– raw milk and raw kefir or other fermented foods) and Feed your bacteria well ( prebiotic foods—most foods at a farmers market ).
This aint rocket science.
Any thoughts on this….CP and Lykke what do you think?
Is this the same science that you believe in? A Princeton microbiologist PHD is not an idiot, neither is Dr. Jeff Gordon at the centers for genome science.
This means that bacteria are critical to our existence and our care and concern for their populations in our bodies is also imparative. This means that anti-biotics are suicide pills as we kill off 85% of what makes us human.
Mark
Very interesting Mark do you have any links to the Bassler and Gordon info? This sounds a bit like the argument that Louis Pasteur "won" but the man that was CORRECT was lost in the dust bin of history.
"It is dangerous to be right in matters on which the established authorities are wrong" Voltaire.
It is always difficult to assess your interpretation of information. You have a way of placing your own personal spin in the interpretation department. The BSK study is a perfect example.
I found this link on bacteria I thought you would enjoy reading. Ive followed most of the principles of Donna Gates work for about 3 years. A healthy lifestyle is not all about raw milk.
http://www.bodyecology.com/07/04/26/microbes_clean_toxic_waste.php
Raw butter is the only dairy product she advocates to consume raw. Is the risk of raw butter being contaminated with a pathogen lower because of its high fat content? I know many believe raw cheese that has been aged for 90 days is equal to pasteurization for safety. She does not advocate drinking raw milk.
http://www.bodyecology.com/07/07/05/benefits_of_real_butter.php
The steroid argument is interesting. I guess it would be O.K. with the pro raw milk group to give steroids to children/teens that play sports. It would give them an added boost in performance. Its a parents right to make this choice.
cp
First, what Mark said was not an interpretation, it was a summary.
A summary of what these scientist have known and/or resently discovered, and are now sharing with the world. So, Mark was not
"spinning" any "yarn" regarding this information on bacteria and the
human genome.
On the other hand, Donna Gates, as far as I know is not a scientist.
She just wants to sell you her "culture" product to ferment vegies!
FYI, you don’t need someone’s "culture" product to ferment vegies! That’s right, if you want to learn how to ferment vegies naturally/safely please read Wild Fermentation by Sandor Katz. Mother Nature and all her exquisit "tools" are right in front of us, if we’ll only "get it," and use it
with a touch of common sense!
Alyssa
I’m a little uncomfortable with this logic nutritionally speaking, because there is physical harm to taking sterioids. They shut down your adrenals, which can produce natural steroids, until they’re told they don’t need to. Whereas milk actually puts things back in balance.
To me there’s another rule, along with the right to choose what you put in your body; it’s the right to give our children their genetic potential, free of synthetic food and RNA-warping expression.
Mark talks about the importance of bacteria in genetic expression. It’s important to know that nutrition affects gene expression too – the lack of a certain nutrients will make sleek brown mice turn into fat white mice. Scientists have shown that reintroducing nutrients will produce sleek brown mice in subsequent generations of mice. Genetic companies hate this, and insist that DNA determines destiny. But that’s another big fat marketing lie.
Humans need real food to propagate and prosper, and we need freedom to be human.
-Blair
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/15/business/15ingredients.html?pagewanted=1&_r=1&hp
"But attempts by The New York Times to follow the directions on several brands of frozen meals, including ConAgras Banquet pot pies, failed to achieve the required 165-degree temperature. Some spots in the pies heated to only 140 degrees even as parts of the crust were burnt."
Does this mean it is up to the victim to prove they followed the package instructions and still got ill from contamination?
I do think that consumers bear responsibility to reasonably look out for their well-being, but the entire reason for this product to exist is for its convenience.
Shouldn’t all parties bear responsibility? It appears that many companies know they have a potential contamination problem yet they continue to keep thier product on the market, the recent peanut contamination is an example.
It seems that many don’t know how to cook from scratch, time, or lack there of, is a factor.
Alyssa, thanx for the book information, I believe Mother Nature knows best.
"Humans need real food to propagate and prosper" this is very true.
Im not sure I understand your point about Donna Gates. I believe Sally Fallon has a masters degree in English and owns a publishing company, but the WAPF crowd reveres her as a nutrition goddess. Using your logic, then I guess you would agree that Sally is only interested in selling you the books she publishes.
cp
I had not heard of Donna Gates, so I googled her;
a nutritionist who pairs herself with higher educated people, http://www.bodyecology.com/
and Sally fallon, who has a degree too and paired with nutritionist/biochemist/MDs etc.
http://westonaprice.org/board.html
Appears when one reads/researches they would be prudent to take the information that fits thier needs from many sources, and store what doesn’t fit for any chnges in the future. I can’t imagine anyone being so gullible to swallow all of just one entity and disregard the rest.
I searched briefly on Sally’s web site and found only written informational items for sale http://westonaprice.org/membership/orderform.html
…https://shop.bodyecology.com/ this site made it easy to find thier "store" with many processed items.
To CP: my apologies to you if my last post was vague or unclear. It was written hastily. In my pursuit of knowledge for both intellectual satisfaction as well as knowledge that I may apply to practical daily diet that will keep me healthy I have had to develop a functional descernment that helps me in critical thought of all the written information that I read in books, on the http://www., and video material. Each person "filters" information according to their level of skillful function in the language, their intelletual capacity to comprehend, and thier capacity to share ideas with others so as to further broaden thier scope of understanding. (Hence, one good reaso we blog!) In the case of nutrition, one also hopes to find the necessary science that allows for a solid foundation upon which to build knowledge necessary when translationg what we haave learned into daily appplication. For me, that trasnlation for health is whole, unadulterated, unprocessed, unaltered, nother-nature designed nutrient dense nourishment. That kind of information cannot be acquired from only one source nor from just one educational field. The WAPF confirmed what generations of my family intuitively knew regarding healthy food/diet; and with that condfirmation came rational, reasonable sicience to back up their positions. It also confirmed some of the unhealthy eating gabits and other lifestyle choices that brought misery and stress, and consequently possible reasons explaining the occurrance of my own disability. The WAPF did this with a marketing format that allowed for minimal commercial interest. This is why I also appreciate Dr. Mercola.com and the newsletter from Dr. Williams, over web-sites like Donna Gates. In other words, that these web-sites/newsletters HAVE a commercial interest is not the issue, but that they don’t hold basic fundamental knowledge (especially for ‘newbies’) hostage to those interests. (E.g. one doesn’t need to purchase latobacillus culture in order to ferment vegies.)That you have followed her protocol is a commendabble achievement, because it means that she motivated you to at leasst steer away from the SAD. This is a good thing! However, IMHO, she does not achieve basic comprehensive content, and the context is biased toward the site’s commercial interest. Having said that, do I think her sight or protocol is worthless? Of course not! However, I descern that as a reader I must look elsewhere for, as the late Paul Harvey used to say, "the rest of the story." That she does not recommend raw milk is another red flag for me. These kind of ommisions point to a bias that does not have the health of the reader as its central regard. There is mother-natured designed food/supplements/herbs and mand-made "phood," drugs,/synthetic supplement. Each of us must decide the balance proportion of these two paradigms that will make up our daily fare.
Stay healthy, and don’t be afraid of taking your own personal journey, hopefully, one that leads to a quality of life. Alyssa Pellicano
First you would have to read Donna Gates book The Body Ecology Diet before you could even make statements about her work. Im trying not to be sarcastic, but I laugh at how much you would agree with her principles if you read her book. You dont need to buy any of her products to become healthy. She offers them for added support (not unlike Joe Mercola), but they are not a must.
Alyssa, you rule her out because she doesnt support the use of raw milk. This is the problem I see with WAPF group. Raw milk is on this pedestal. Im happy that raw milk works for you, but others are being seriously harmed by it. Maybe this is why Donna Gates is not an advocate for raw milk; there is a down side. She has discovered the healing power of fermented young coconut juice. This is no different than selling kefir made from milk. Kefir grains are used during the fermenting process. It is not processed.
The first 6 months her diet involves no dairy and when you finally add dairy it should be only kefir. She does support the use of raw butter; believes it is healing to the body. This takes me back to my original question about raw butter. Because of the high fat content, is it less likely to become contaminated? It makes no since that she would support raw butter, but not raw milk. There must be a logical reason.
In a nutshell, Donna Gates book addresses health issues that involve an impaired immune system & Candia overgrowth. A huge part of her work focuses on gut heath. She teaches people how to use food combining to become healthy. In other words, healthy food is a persons best medicine.
3 years ago I purchased an infrared sauna. During that timeframe I was doing a lot of reading about toxins and heavy metals stored in our bodies. I wanted to go on an herbal cleanse and my naturopathic doctor recommended Donna Gates diet.
Donna Gates and WAPF are not incompatible, thats probably why she was a speaker at the last WAPF conference. Whats different is how the food should be combined to achieve optimal health. For example, when you eat a meal, it should be 80% veggies and 20% gluten free grains or protein. You never eat starchy vegetables and/or grains and protein at the same time. It inhibits digestion. When you eat fruit, it should be alone. I hate that it is called a diet, because it is really more like a philosophy of eating.
I encourage both of you to read the book. You will be surprised at what you find.
cp
1.) I would only have to read Ms. Gate’s book if you and I agree to organize our own book club of the month, so as to discuss each and every point she makes as the author of her book. Since that isn’t the case in this forum, we must cut one another some slack that we haven’t both read and garnered nutritional information from the same author. Having said that, the philosopjy of food combining is not her original concept, but I have no doubt that she has done her research well because she is so focused on optimizing the diet of autistics. Also, I am not UNfamiliar with the food combining protocol, as I have read three other books on the same subject: Alkalize or Die, by, T.A.Baroody: Acid &Alkaline, by H.Aihara, and The Alkalizing Diet, by I. Fazekas. The 80/20 ratio are in all three books, just presented differently, but with similar explanations. So, I wansn’t making statements about her detailed work, only about the general concepts. I don’t see why you would find it amusing that I would agree with her principles, because I do find the food combining concepts meritorious especially for transitioning from the overly acidic SAD, and moving toward a more healthy fare.
2.) I do not rule her out! The fact that she doesn’t support the use of raw milk simply defines her own uniqueness ot the nutritional concepts that she finds to be helpful in her quest to find solutions to the autistic problem. If you see the WAPF putting raw milk on a pedestal, it is because of its very nutrient dense nutritional nature. However, the WAPF also points out that those Cultures that did not drink milk placed a high value on organ meats, animal fat, both sources that have been demonized in our modern society (and for some good reasons, by default, thanks to the unconscionable animal husbandry practices of today[s CAFO’s); or from foods that the western palate would find repulsive, e.g. raw sea food, and insects; or foods to inconvenient for today’s fast paced living, namely, bone broths. (only bones from grass fed animals if one does this) Both sides of any argument can have logical origins, so I concede that any food mishandled could be seriously harmful! That fact is all over the nightly news these days. However, since raw milk has ancient historical evidence as serving mankind as a sustainable food source, then I would have to ask what is going on in OUR ecology that has the collateral affect of putting fresh milk in such a position. Again, I would point to our convoluted and disrespectful "farming" practices that obstruct every natual order of our ecological environment. The "down side" lives in man’s "fixes" of practices that run counter to respecting the nature of ruminant animals NOT in the raw milk itself. One cannot feed a ruminant animal moldy, defunct pastry & m&m’s and expect the products thereof to have the properties equal to those products from ruminatnt who have been fed green grass on soil that has had proper stewardship care and not within close proximity to a host of other ecological disasters. Talk about acidosis! Disrespect mother nature and you WILL get the deadly pathogens like e-coli 0157:H7!
3.) About fermented coconut juice: yes, no doubt an excellent probiotic. However, that there is "no differnet than selling kefir made with milk.?" On what level?…Nutritional equivalence? or that both are fermented products? Kefir grains are a symbiotic combination of yeast and bacteria(the good ones) They thrive and grow/multiply in milk (milk sugar/milk fat), they do not thrive in other mediums, althought they will PERFORM and ferment other liquids, to our delight. (S.Katz, Wild Fermentation, pg.89) And, yes, I know we are not talking about a "processed" "phood." Specifically, D. Gates is using the fermented c. juice for detoxifying autistic children and to rebuild gut flora. About your question on raw butter. Go to u-tube and watch/listen to the video made with D. Gates/Dr.N.Campbell-McBride. This really does sound vvery familiar as it is not contradictory to the principles outlined by WAPF. The brain is make up of 12% arachidonic acid which is found in raw butter and other animal fats, egg yolks, ect. The human body (especially in the crisis of autism) need this fatty acid, among others. Butter also is the major contributor to healing the gut lining so that good bacteria can colonize and nutrients/minerals can be absorbed. It has nothing to do with a question of contamination.
4.) You have an excellent naturopathic doctor recommending D.Gates diet, because infusion chelation therapy, while quite effective, is suppose to be very hard on the physiology. Why be hard on your body if one can chelate heavy metals naturally through juicing and fermentation of veggies/other foods & liquids. All of this is supported by the aforementioned video.
5.) So, the WAPF and D.Gates/Dr.MCBride do sound very similar/compativle. But it is possible to come to similar conclusions via other authors as well! E.g. M. Pollan: The Omnivor’s Dilemma and In Defense of Food: "Eat Food, Not Much, Mostly Plants." Sounds like the 80/20 ratio to me, and no mention of food combining. BTW I don’t combine oranges with my milk either, but that’s not to say someone else could and not have digestive upsets. It truly is all about the journey, not so much the destination! Alyssa
Donna Gates did not create this diet to heal autistic children, the autistic world found her. Also, the concepts of food combining and 80/20 ratio are not her ideas, but she uses them as part of her philosophy.
You missed the point. For me and others raw dairy is about possible contamination. My guess is that Donna Gates has stayed away from advocating raw milk because of possible contamination issues. Im just curious about the choice for raw butter. She also talks about using ghee and coconut oil.
My naturopathic doctor worries about the use of raw milk with autistic children for the same exact reasons I do. Donna Gates has found something that is just as effective but does come with the risk of poop. WAPF is doing a disservice advocating raw milk for this population. Their immune systems are too weak to handle pathogen contamination.
I am not speaking from theory about all of this, my nephew is moderately autistic and the principles of this diet have really helped him.
cp
I am truly happy for your relative who has improved on the aformentioned diet. I hope his future remains healthy.
But as for this exchange, it has ended. You can’t get away from the hype of contamination fear, and no one will ever convince me that mother nature doesn’t know best.
end conversation. alyssa